LIBRA1's PIP Queries Topic !!!

I have bipolar affective disorder 1. I was sectioned in 2009. I have had one other psychotic episode in 2012, otherwise all my episodes have been depression.

I was granted DLA, higher rate care and lower rate mobility for 5 years in 2011. My award runs until March 2016. At the time I was awarded, I was under the care of a Psychiatrist and CMHT as well as my current GP. Also, at that time, I had recently been awarded ESA (WRAG).

I was discharged from my Psychiatrist to the care of my GP in late 2011 and have been on anti-depressant and anti-psychotic medication ever since. I have no care plan, other than family (sister and daughter) to monitor and assist me, as well as visits to my GP as and when I have been in any acute crisis. I ended my ESA claim in early 2014 and began work self-employed at home for 16 hours per week and receive working tax credits with the disability element. My last acute episode was a depressive one in the early summer this year, my medication was increased by my GP. I did not resort to claiming ESA as I struggled to continue working as I couldn't bear the idea of having to go through any assessment process as any dealings with the DWP traumatises me too much.

The question I have is that compared to when I was first awarded my DLA, I have had more stable periods since... helped by the DLA, the fact that my working life is minimal and in my home environment so that I can weather the effects of the medication and avoid exposure to stresses of the outside world which trigger my episodes. The medication, the supervision of my GP and the care from my family help me manage my illness and so I have never been referred back to psychiatric services.

I realise from all that I read about PIP and the fact that my condition fluctuates and is variable, that it is very difficult to meet the descriptors adequately to reflect exactly how it is that my condition disables me. It clearly does because prior to being diagnosed, I was a busy professional working long hours and now I am a pretty reclusive home-worker as it is all I can manage as my condition dictates.

I also recognise from all I read that one stands a better chance of being awarded PIP if one has as much medical evidence as possible to accompany PIP2. The problem is all I have is the word of my GP and he would not be able to give much detail about the day to day descriptors other than what I have reported to him. I intend to send in letters written by my sister and my daughter (who have detailed knowledge of the difficulties I face).

Is this going to count against me? The fact I am not under psychiatric services?

It seems desperately unfair to me that this reform of DLA has resulted in PIP. The whole point of the supervision provisions within the DLA was that it recognised that someone with a mental health condition had varied need for help for their fluctuating disability. But, with PIP, there is some kind of arbitrary percentage (50%) over a 12 month period which is given as a cut off point as to whether your illness disables you or not. With bipolar disorder, you can have almost the whole of a 12 month period disable you and then be more stable for a further 12 months before the whole cycle starts all over again. It is so unpredictable and it is for life.

I am desperately trying not to let the arrival of the brown envelope destabilise me right now... although the sleep deprivation has started with a vengeance in spite of the sedating medication, and that is always the first symptom of my hypomania. If I am not awarded PIP, the loss of that money will create chaos in my finances which are finely tuned (my income drop has been considerable) and that instability will inevitably precipitate my mental health into further crises. It always does.

Gordon,

Thank you for your considered response recognising my difficulties in approaching my PIP application in my circumstances.

If it assists, I completed your short PIP test and these were the results:

DAILY LIVING COMPONENT
You assessed yourself as scoring the following points for the daily living component of PIP:


1 d. Needs prompting to be able to either prepare or cook a simple meal. 2 points

2 d. Needs prompting to be able to take nutrition. 4 points

3 c. Needs supervision, prompting or assistance to be able to manage therapy that takes no more than 3.5 hours a week. 2 points

4 c. Needs supervision or prompting to be able to wash or bathe. 2 points

6 c. Needs either - (i) prompting to be able to dress, undress or determine appropriate circumstances for remaining clothed; or (ii) prompting or assistance to be able to select appropriate clothing. 2 points

9 c. Needs social support to be able to engage with other people. 4 points

10 b. Needs prompting or assistance to be able to make complex budgeting decisions. 2 points


Total points: 18


Whilst, I scored nothing for mobility at all, within the daily living section, the point is that it is only a snapshot of me in acute periods as well as less acute periods and I would imagine that given more details and a description of the frequency of these limitations that my points score for daily living would not actually be as high.

The point you make about why I was discharged from the CMHT and my Psych is a good one and I need to find out when I see my GP next week why exactly that happened.

My recollection is that my original Psychiatrist left the health authority, I was given a new Psychiatrist who I did not really gel with (my daughter was with me) and I remember it was me, I think, telling her that I didn't need to see her anymore because my GP would take care of me. At the time, I was erratic with complying with my medication and in fact, I recall (hypomanically obviously) lecturing her that the myth of the chemical cure wasn't all it was cracked up to be. She disagreed obviously but saw no 'warning bells' that my insight into my illness was poor because she agreed to discharge me to my GP. At least, I think that is what happened. I think, I also recall, that she told me something about restructuring in the unit - so it could have also been a resource based decision or administrative one? I really don't remember. Suffice to say, I stopped taking my meds, believed I was somehow cured and would one day be able to go back to work, get a referral to declare I never had bipolar in the first place and come off DLA and ESA! Four months later, I had another psychotic episode. This time, it was in my home with my sister present the whole time supervising, caring and monitoring me where I practically had her mentally imprisoned begging her not to call an ambulance and section me. She eventually managed to get me to take my medication and I was knocked out. I went to my GP with a letter from my sister shortly thereafter to report what had happened and still, I was not referred to psychiatric services because I didn't want it. I have a terror of being sectioned again. My GP urged me to seek therapeutic help in the area and gave me details of local services but I did not want it or follow it up. Later that summer came a crashing depression, inevitably.

Sorry for the long history... but suffice to say, since then there has been mild hypomania but mostly depression.. all of which my GP knows about and has adjusted medication accordingly with my sister and daughter caring for and monitoring me. I also now fully accept my diagnosis and have dialled back my life in order to self-manage. A huge element of the disability with bipolar disorder is non-compliance with medication (although I am now fully compliant) but mostly at most danger when one appears to be well and lacking insight into how fragile one is in the spiral. It is trial and error recognising the triggers and symptoms and self-managing and also vital to have those caring for you to monitor exactly this and step in to prevent deterioration.

I notice that particular descriptor (monitoring treatment) only attracts 1 point? It is the whole point of managing bipolar disorder, as well as for me, complying with my medication.

But thank you for all the info. you have provided.

Hi Libra

Thanks for the further info.

I think its probably best to follow Gordons advice with regard to seeing tour GP and accessing tour medical notes for paperwork from your psychiatric treatment and taking copies of documents detailing diagnoses, treatment and discharge. Gordon has supplied the links to info on how to do this.

Other than that, easy to say, is to,try to relax and know you have prepared as best you can. The point of PIP is to reduce the benefit bill. Hopefully you will get your award without too much stress and aggravation.

Hello,

If I am not awarded PIP in the first instance, I know I can apply for mandatory reconsideration. I also know that my DLA will end about 4 weeks after a decision to refuse me PIP. What I am wondering is, if I apply for mandatory reconsideration after refusal, will my DLA continue to be paid during that time? Would the second decision, if refused again be the binding decision, after which the 4 weeks runs?

My concern is that I do not want to be without my DLA payment at any time before going to appeal.

I know I am sounding pessimistic because I haven't even started my claim yet - gathering medical evidence at the moment - but from EVERYTHING I am reading (including advice from MIND), with a mental health condition which fluctuates and the emphasis on limitations around 'physical activity' descriptors, it is very hard to meet the thresholds to qualify. There is almost no case law available on this as PIP is so new. With DLA, after 15 years, FINALLY mental health disability was put on a par with physical disability by recognising supervision needs holistically. This has been totally WIPED by PIP. It is utterly nasty. It makes a mockery of what this government said on re-election that they would take mental health seriously.

Why is mental illness the poor relation? Why?

Just as predicted, my symptoms have become aggravated. My meds have to be increased and I am heading for meltdown. This happened to me on ESA too. Every time I have to deal with the DWP and what it has become under Ian Duncan Smith, my bipolar symptoms flare up. I would do anything to induce a hypomanic high now. Anything. I want to be oblivious. But, I am under supervision by my GP and my family, who won't let me.

Sorry for the rant.

Thank you.

libra1 wrote: Hello,

If I am not awarded PIP in the first instance, I know I can apply for mandatory reconsideration. I also know that my DLA will end about 4 weeks after a decision to refuse me PIP. What I am wondering is, if I apply for mandatory reconsideration after refusal, will my DLA continue to be paid during that time? Would the second decision, if refused again be the binding decision, after which the 4 weeks runs?

My concern is that I do not want to be without my DLA payment at any time before going to appeal.

I know I am sounding pessimistic because I haven't even started my claim yet - gathering medical evidence at the moment - but from EVERYTHING I am reading (including advice from MIND), with a mental health condition which fluctuates and the emphasis on limitations around 'physical activity' descriptors, it is very hard to meet the thresholds to qualify. There is almost no case law available on this as PIP is so new. With DLA, after 15 years, FINALLY mental health disability was put on a par with physical disability by recognising supervision needs holistically. This has been totally WIPED by PIP. It is utterly nasty. It makes a mockery of what this government said on re-election that they would take mental health seriously.

Why is mental illness the poor relation? Why?

Just as predicted, my symptoms have become aggravated. My meds have to be increased and I am heading for meltdown. This happened to me on ESA too. Every time I have to deal with the DWP and what it has become under Ian Duncan Smith, my bipolar symptoms flare up. I would do anything to induce a hypomanic high now. Anything. I want to be oblivious. But, I am under supervision by my GP and my family, who won't let me.

Sorry for the rant.

Thank you.

Hi l1,

Whatever the PIP decision is, and no matter what you decide to do when you receive the PIP decision, your DLA payment will cease 4 weeks after the date of the original PIP decision.

Once you go through the DLA to PIP transfer, and your DLA payments cease 4 weeks after the date of the PIP decision, that is it, your DLA is finished.

If you request an MR of an adverse PIP decision, the adverse PIP decision will exist until either it is changed at the MR stage, or if not then up to the date of a Tribunal Decision if you go on to appeal.

i.e. Whilst an MR or Appeal is ongoing, if you did not gain a PIP award, you will receive no monies after your final DLA payment unless you gain a PIP award at MR or Appeal stage.

Any successful increase to the adverse PIP award gained as the result of an MR or Appeal will be back dated to the date of the original adverse PIP award.

bro58