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  • Jonathan1975
16 May 2024 11:26

ESA exempt ('permitted') work, earnings offsets, self-employment, & hours issues

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi,

I found recently, to my great happiness, I could cope with a bit of part-time driving work, but am finding extreme difficulty in getting any shifts given to me through my temp agencies. So through other sources, i.e. gig and part-time permanent or contract work, it's extremely hard to find stuff that's consistently within the earnings limits: most proper employers pay above minimum wage now. And some gig ones have funny hours/pay patterns. This is also material for a friend on PIP and ESA-LCWRA who through nominal self-employment has occasionally exceeded hours/earnings limits (under her interpretation of the rules). So:


Pension contributions and net earnings

Can pension contributions reduce employed earnings prior to the £183.50 (min wage x 16hrs) assessment being applied for ESA exempt ('permitted') work purposes, in the way it does for income tax, i.e. it reducing the pre-income-tax income by 50% of the amount contributed?


Pension contribs and gig work/self-employed net earnings

If so could pension contributions achieve a similar result in the case of nominally self-employed gig work, through ad-hoc contributions?


Pension contribs and employers refusing to operate pension schemes

Where an employer refuses to operate a pension scheme, can I reduce my nominal earnings for ESA purposes by making ad-hoc contributions?



Statutory holiday pay, minimum wage, and the moment at which the holiday pay is deemed to have been earned

Given for income tax purposes statutory holiday pay must (surely?) be deemed to be earned in the week in which the employee elects for it to be taken, and given some employers are entitled to pay it at the same time as the wage (as long as it’s itemized), do those latter (immediate) payments a) get treated as not immediate earnings for tax purposes and b) for ESA purposes?


Statutory holiday pay, minimum wage, and self-employment (as matter of statutory interpretation)

and given as a matter of policy & statutory interpretation it’s unrealistic to presume self-employed workers don’t need/won’t take holidays, can an analogous ‘holiday apportionment’ be applied to self-employed earners’ incomes, to raise the weekly £183.50 cap by the statutory holiday minimum of 12.07%, i.e. to £205.65 (so long as the earner takes 5.6 weeks’ holiday, or less on a pro-rata basis)?


Unpaid travel time between piecework jobs, and 16 hour limit

Does unpaid travel time on public transport between piecework gig (car delivery) jobs in a several-delivery day count as work hours?


Point at which the week begins for purposes of 16 hour limit

If a gig ‘employer’ (in fact they declare it’s self-employment’) only offers a minimum of 3-day tranches of work, paid by cars delivered (3-4 deliveries a day, £20-£28 a delivery, they estimate £80 income a day, although some online report as little as £40-50, they estimate taking 8-10 hours to perform), could someone in my shoes with a 16 hour limit (18 with averaging) declare my week-beginning to be after one of those 3 days, and do one 3-day tranche every two weeks instead of every one week, ergo on one ‘week’ I do 1 shift and on another ‘week’ I do two?


New PW1 form for each new work pattern?

Do I need to submit a new PW1 form for every new employer (or gigwork organizer) given each will have a slightly different work-pattern, pay, and set of duties?


Can one begin work if technically uncertain but has at least arguable case about PW1 (permitted/exempt work terms) compliance?

If I’m worried that a ‘no’ answer might be forthcoming to one of the above questions arising from a PW1 submission, but that a ‘yes’ is crucial to it falling within permitted work rules, does that mean I can/can’t begin the work but submit a PW1 immediately if I’m to keep my ESA, or is it OK to begin the work, submit PW1 immediately, and then stop it if ESA say it doesn’t fall within the rules?


I truly despair of getting any other work I can do with my current training and experience and capability level, and these questions and similar have become crucial, both for me and a friend in a similar position.

With enormous thanks - Jonathan
  • Gary
26 Mar 2024 21:19
Replied by Gary on topic DWP Compliance Interview

DWP Compliance Interview

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi ArchieD123

I have never come across one, and I have been doing benefits for many years. I have heard from members on the forum who have undergone a compliance interview, from reading the link I sent you, Once your identity has been confirmed, you will be informed of the purpose of the interview.

Hopefully forum members who have also had a compliance interview will be able to offer you first hand experience.

Gary
  • ArchieD123
26 Mar 2024 20:54
Replied by ArchieD123 on topic DWP Compliance Interview

DWP Compliance Interview

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Thanks Gary.

I’ve read elsewhere online that these interviews are being requested randomly. Is it likely be a full investigation or could it just be to verify the information I gave at the telephone assessment? I’ve never been asked to have one of these previously.
  • Gary
26 Mar 2024 20:41
Replied by Gary on topic DWP Compliance Interview

DWP Compliance Interview

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi ArchieD123

Welcome to the forum.

You might want to have a look at the following FAQ which explains where everything is; www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/guides-for-claimants/faq/forum.

A DWP compliance interview, also referred to as a customer compliance interview, is a procedure undertaken by the DWP where they have reason to suspect that you are claiming a benefit that you are not entitled to, or if they suspect that your personal circumstances have changed but that you have not notified them of the change; www.stuartmillersolicitors.co.uk/dwp-com...iew-questions-guide/

Gary
  • ArchieD123
26 Mar 2024 20:11
DWP Compliance Interview was created by ArchieD123

DWP Compliance Interview

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi,

I recently had a telephone assessment for my PIP renewal and now I have received a letter in the post saying I am to have a compliance interview with the DWP with a date and time. It doesn’t give any more details than that.

Does anyone know what this could be about or whether it is something to worry about?

Thanks
  • denby
22 Mar 2024 23:56

Journal entry from compliance officer. Is this how they should be speaking?

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Andrew, as C says, it is the comment
""you are the only person prolonging this review with your persistent hospital admissions"
that is disgusting bullying.
Please maybe a little, put yourself in the original poster's shoes before drafting a reply which, on the surface at least, seems to lack empathy for someone whose condition/s mean they have been in and out of hospital repeatedly. That is very disorientating in itself, and dealing with admin on top can be difficult. Thank you for, I hope, reflecting.
  • Andrew
22 Mar 2024 20:56

Journal entry from compliance officer. Is this how they should be speaking?

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

I`m afraid I don`t read the response from DWP as "disgusting" or "bullying". I read it as a person trying to do her job but getting little, or no, cooperation from her "client" (for want of an expression).

"The department can and are able to infer from your lack of engagement with the A42 form"; this isn`t bullying or disgusting, the DWP lady was advising that they have the power to assume that someone isn`t being helpful or truthful (I`m not calling anyone a liar here, this is my interpretation of the details provided).

"Firstly I have told them I will sign the forms if they are filled out correctly"; On face value this is implies that they don`t agree with how the A42 is completed, but why they aren`t completed correctly isn`t mentioned. To allow people to make an informed comment, it would have been better to provide a bit more information.

Before you respond, please understand I am not criticising anybody here, I`m just explaining my interpretation of the situation based on the comments of the poster.
  • C
22 Mar 2024 12:25

Journal entry from compliance officer. Is this how they should be speaking?

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

"you are the only person prolonging this review with your persistent hospital admissions" - this is a SHOCKING and disgusting statement. How dare they imply your hospital admissions are a choice deliberately engineered to delay their processes? Absolutely revolting behaviour from them, I'm so, so sorry they're treating you like this. Solidarity.
  • denby
21 Mar 2024 01:09
  • JaneyJane
20 Mar 2024 18:30

Journal entry from compliance officer. Is this how they should be speaking?

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hello again,

Recieved the flooring message this morning after calling the compliance officer to tell her I will not sign an A42 form if it is sent blank. Happy to allow her to check what she has queries about but I’m not handing over permission for who knows what or for how long

"Good morning ******. The department can and are able to infer from your lack of engagement with the
A42 form that this account is indeed yours. If it is not simply signing this will enable me to prove to a level I am happy with that it is not yours. Perhaps we should just start to be truthful, if you admit the account is yours we can work out your overpayment and this situation can end. At this stage you are the only person prolonging this review with your persistent hospital admissions and refusal to allow the department to do the necessary checks. I have sent out further A42 forms today and will be in contact with your branch. I will be in touch shortly

Firstly I have told them I will sign the forms if they are filled out correctly , secondly it would seem the DWP can know presume guilt with no evidence of you don’t do what one person says?
  • JaneyJane
18 Mar 2024 10:40
A42 form request form Dwp was created by JaneyJane

A42 form request form Dwp

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hello (again) and I apologise if these questions seem silly.
I cannot locate a bank account the DWP are suggesting is mine. I suspect it’s a ppi refund that they are thinking is something else but despite giving her that paperwork she still wants statements form an account I do not own. Obviously the bank will not divulge anything about this account to me.

The compliance officer has said she will send out an A42 form but she wouldn’t/couldn’t tell me if this gives them access to all my accounts (nothing to hide but I have supplied statements for these accounts already so it’s unnecessary) she also wouldn’t/couldn’t tell me if this form allows a one off enquiry or if I have signed my bank accounts over to them for good.
I have tried googling but I’m not coming up with anything so far.
The bank are willing to write a letter to say this account does not match any I have had or currently have but this is not acceptable proof apparently.

Any advice appreciated
  • Chris
17 Mar 2024 11:34

Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi JaneyJane,

Wow - sounds like you've got a "I know it all" type of compliance officer on your case. I think when they say anything like that, it's best to ask them if they can send it to you in writing or via email, then you've actually got concrete evidence of making a complaint, especially if they're telling you things that are incorrect, which would leave you panicking that you could end up stuck in Ireland.

There is a complaints procedure online via the Gov.uk website - it may help give you guidance with what you were wanting to know about the length of time, or if not, who you could turn to for an answer.

www.gov.uk/government/organisations/depa...complaints-procedure

Regards, Chris
  • JaneyJane
16 Mar 2024 17:12
Replied by JaneyJane on topic Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Thank you for your reply. I have managed to get through to my case manager at UC who cannot find any rules that say I cannot go abroad. He has agreed to suspend my claim to prevent any future overpayments occurring.
Do you know how long the dwp take to answer official complaints? Myself
And my MP both submitted complaints and have heard nothing.
Aside from the comment from the compliance officer stating “you have no reason to complain”
  • JaneyJane
16 Mar 2024 15:59
Replied by JaneyJane on topic Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Thanks. Unfortunately the appt I have with CAB is the quickest one I can get.
I’m not in the UK at present and obviously caring for my dad is taking up a lot of my time.
I was just concerned as the compliance officer stated she can have my passport cancelled which would leave me stuck in Ireland.
  • Gordon
16 Mar 2024 15:52 - 16 Mar 2024 15:55

Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

JJ

As far as I can find the DWP does not have the authority to seize your passport or prevent you from leaving the country.

So, I would start by asking the Compliance Officer for specific references to the legislation they would be invoking to do these things.

Given how this issue appears to be escalating you should certainly get advice from a trained advisor. See

advicelocal.uk/

I know you already have an appointment booked with the CAB, try and escalate the issue with them to see if you can get a quicker one

you should also consider getting legal advice, you may be able to get free advice if you can keep the consultation to less than an hour.

I'm afraid we cannot offer any advice about your returning to the DWP or not.

Gordon
  • JaneyJane
16 Mar 2024 14:05

Compliance review still on going after 5 months

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hello! I posted before giving all the horrible details of my experience with a compliance officer.
I sent them all the bank statements they requested. They lost these and I had to resend. Thought that would be it but I’m now being asked for more details about the same account (an ISA) I do not have.
I supplied a letter from the bank showing all the account numbers o have or have had with them.
Nope still not good enough, she wants statements which I am unable to provide as it’s not my account.

Things now get complicated, I have had to go to Ireland as my dad had a stroke and needs care. I’ll be here at least 8 weeks (I’m also waiting on being rehoused in the uk so could be longer)
I updated my journal to tell them I went to Ireland on March 13th and will be here for 8 weeks (minimum) I asked for my claim to be closed/suspended as I know my entitlement will end. I claim PIP too so I know I have to be back within 12 weeks. I recieved the following journal entry yesterday
“Hi Jane, the review has taken so long due to your mental health issues and your desire to involve your MP. Whilst the Department is sorry to here about your alleged Menatl health issues and your fathers ill health at this time I am not in a position to authorise ANY absence from the UK until such time as I have completed my review. For the same reasons your claim will not be stopped/suspended.
Once I am satisfied with the documentation you have submitted we will be in touch and you can at that point end your claim and leave the country.
Whilst this may be difficult for you to hear, it is a condition of receiving means tested benefits that you engage with the process and rules.”

The issue is I’m already in Ireland with my dad (his stroke was very bad and he had no one to help him once he was out of hospital)
Do I need to return to the UK? The compliance officer has threatens to have my passport cancelled (via a telephone call) if I try to, in her words “skip the country”

I have put in a formal complaint as has my MP but so far we have been ignored.

Should I return to the UK? I have some everything in they requested but she still wants statements from an account I don’t have.
I have severe mental health issues and this all started whilst I was in a psych ward and she was calling and messaging daily (my psychiatrist wrote to them detailing the effect this is having but this too was ignored)

Can anyone help? I’m struggling to care for my dad, look after my own mental health and now I’m terrified I won’t have a passport to come home?

Any advice would be much appreciated

Regards
  • Gary
11 Mar 2024 21:45
Replied by Gary on topic Compliance Phone Call

Compliance Phone Call

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi CRPSWarrior

The only thing you can do is contact DWP and ask, to put your mind at ease.

Gary
  • traceybouch
11 Mar 2024 20:04
Replied by traceybouch on topic Compliance Phone Call

Compliance Phone Call

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

No nothing. Just said thank you for clarifying
  • BIS
11 Mar 2024 14:30
Replied by BIS on topic Compliance Phone Call

Compliance Phone Call

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi CRPSWarrior

We can't speculate on the reason for your call because we simply don't know. Did the person not tell you what would happen next?

BIS
  • traceybouch
09 Mar 2024 12:42
Compliance Phone Call was created by traceybouch

Compliance Phone Call

Category: ESA, PIP and DLA Queries and Results

Hi everyone. I had a dreaded brown envelope a couple of weeks ago when I had just come out of hospital after spinal and neck surgery.

I rang the number and asked what it was for and the gentleman just said it was a review with a couple of questions. The call was today, 2 weeks later.

I spent 2 days getting all my paperwork together from original claim to bank statements etc and waiting for the call.

He did an ID check on me then asked me a very peculiar question. Going back to 2019 when you claimed, were the DWP aware that you were still employed? I said yes because it’s on my paperwork and I claimed as my sick pay had run out. He asked if it was face to face or by phone - I said face to face at local job centre offices.


He then said I know you don’t work and that you are on higher rate PIP etc. I offered information to him of 2 payments that I had received which I had written to Wolverhampton about.

That was all. Can anyone shed light on this question please just to put my mind at rest? Does it seem like just a random check on detail?
Displaying 1 - 20 out of 58 results.
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