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PIP Query APPEAL
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9 years 1 month ago - 9 years 1 month ago #131676 by jb
PIP Query APPEAL was created by jb
Hello B&W Team
From 2013 – March 2015, I was on DLA Enhanced rate. February/March 2015, I appealed against the PIP decision via Mandatory Reconsideration and yet again, not qualified for the Enhance rate for mobility activities ONLY STANDARD RATE. And ENHANCED RATE for Disability Living Component. Therefore, I want to appeal against DWP PIP decision via Tribunal for Mobility Enhance rate. My indefinite chronic illnesses is to avoid any stress possible, as stress exacerbate my illnesses. My GP has written confirmation letters to both ESA and PIP, explaining that I am unable to work again. For me, this is all about principles of human rights.
Diagnosis: Granulomatosis Polyangitis with Sclerosis (February 2013). Fibromyalgia (October 2013). Followed by severe Anxiety and Depression.
Please can W&B confirm if I can appeal against the following decision to the Tribunal Court?
The following decision confirmed via PIP Decision Assessor(s):
The CQ indicates that she requires assistance for any journey due to severe anxiety or distress, she states she is very uncomfortable going outdoors because of anxiety. She is unable to consider planning any journeys because of anxiety which leads to panic attacks, she cannot use public transport due to severe anxiety and reports a traumatic past experience that affected her for a couple of days.
At the consultation, she indicated she can follow directions to a familiar and unfamiliar locations. (Face to face assessor: He said, that I seemed to be a bright woman, and should need be, could I follow a map for a journey).
(Me: I replied, by going looking on my computer, by using Google map, I would be able to see where I need to go, BUT would not carry out a journey on my own due to my mobility and anxiety. I have not been out on any journeys for a couple of years now, mainly because of my anxiety. DWP failed to note my response).
She is able to travel on *all types of public transport, without difficulty*, although she states she could only do this intellectually she couldn't do it physically or emotionally due to her anxiety and fibromyalgia. (Me: *this is a false statement - assumptions noted via the assessor. How am I able to travel journeys without difficulty, when I suffer with chronic pain and I have not travelled on all types of public transport for a couple of years?).
She will go to familiar places on her own in a taxi, she will not go to unfamiliar places on her own.
(Me: I explained to the assessor, once a month I go to see the psychiatrist for medication review via a taxi, as sometimes, I do not have a choice if my Mental Health Care Coordinator is unable to pick me up. I also go for weekly counselling sessions - both of these visits is for my Well-Being. Therefore, I go to one particular familiar place - assessor assuming I travel to other places).
She will go to the local shop on her scooter. (Me: I explained that I have a scooter on loan, and that I sometimes call in at the local shop, which is just 5 minutes away, if I've run out of milk/bread, for example. I did fail to explain to the assessor, that my journey to the shop is when it’s dark, usually half an hour before shop is closed, due to anxiety of crowd, traffic noise, and general busyness).
Assessor(s) decision, follows on:
This would be consistent with condition, diagnosis and prescribed medication.
Restriction in this area is not noted in the FME. (Me: don't know what this means?)
Therefore from the evidence and the balance of probability it would be reasonable to conclude that she would be able to plan and follow the route of a journey unaided in a reliable, safe and acceptable manner within a reasonable time frame for the majority of the time. (Me: I wish the decision maker could live one week in my shoes and then tell me, I am still able to do journeys).
Mandatory Decision - after I followed up the above:
I have looked at all the evidence again (Me: not my medical evidences, they didn't!).
I have consider the appropriate points have been awarded for all activities as shown below:
You said you have difficulties with moving around. I agree you have difficulties. (Me: But they say I have no difficulties when travelling on public transport!).
You said you have difficulties with planning and following journeys as you do not go out alone travel on public transport due to panic and severe anxiety and would be unable to follow unfamiliar routes. (Me: This is correct. As I have severe anxiety, how am I able to go out to unfamiliar routes by myself? a) my physical mobility stops me, because I am unable to walk too far by familiar routes, let alone unfamiliar places b) due to cognitive anxiety. Common sense plays a part.
This activity considers a claimants ability to plan and follow the route of a journey. A journey means, a local journey, whether that journey is familiar or unfamiliar and to go on that journey would cause overwhelming psychological distress that the person is unable to function without prompting or support from another person. On your questionnaire you stated you can go the local shops which are approx. 5 mins away on your mobility scooter (Me: this should state shop – DWP assuming shops by implying, I go to several shops at any one time. Scooter on loan, and has to be returned) and at the consultation you stated you can go out alone in a taxi. (Me: I did not say I can go out alone in a taxi. I stated I use a taxi for appointments only. I am not really alone am I? In my opinion, the taxi person, can help with my anxiety, because I am not solely travelling on my own).
As these are journeys were you have left the home unaccompanied. (Me: weekly journey appointments only, for counselling, and once a month medication psychiatrist review. I consider these journeys to be mandatory for my Well-Being. Do I have a choice?). I have decided you can manage this activity and I agree with the previous case manager’s decision.
I have limited the period of your award as your needs may change. (Me: what does this mean?).
Me: Other journeys that I stated and is not noted via PIP assessor:
• GP appointments accompanied by my brother/friend, using surgery wheel chair due to mobility and anxiety - this was mentioned, but not noted via PIP face to face, assessor.
• One/numerous hospital appointments every month since being diagnosed - imperative to have organs and bloods checked due to Granulomatosis disease. 2 man pick up via Patients Ambulance Transport, wheel chair used – this was mentioned, but not noted via PIP face to face, assessor.
• Online shopping via the internet for grocery/clothes/household products, due to mobility and anxiety of going out doors – this was mentioned, but not noted via PIP face to face, assessor.
• The scooter was on loan and belongs to a friend who runs a mobility scooter. The scooter has to be returned and scrapped due to not being road worthy, and keeps breaking down.
When the assessor arrived at my house for a face to face consultation, he would not take additional updated copy medical notes – assessor stated they are not allowed, but I could post it - in which I did so, via recorded delivery. PIP department stated that they had not received any further medical letter to support mandatory decision (I still have post office recorded delivery receipt(s)).
The assessor asked me an open-closed question and did not follow on with additional mobility activities optional questions. Here’s how the question was asked:
Assessor: “Can you follow a journey?”
Me: “No, I cannot follow a journey”.
Assessor: “OK! This is what I mean… “You seem like a bright lady, if you had to go on a journey, could you read a map to go on that journey”?
Me: “I don’t really know what you mean? Oh… I see! Well, if I was to go on a journey, I would google map the journey, but I would not go on that journey by myself, as I suffer from anxiety you see… anxiety and depression. I never really go out of the house, I’d love to, but I can’t!
Assessor: “Is that because of your anxiety, did you say?”
Me: “Yes. Urrgghhh! The thought of going out is making me feel all anxious and nauseous right now, thinking about it! No, I would definitely not do that journey, by myself”.
Assessor: “But you can plan a journey”.
Me: “Yes, I can plan a journey”.
Then I proceeded in saying that I sometimes go to the shop on my mobility scooter, which is only 5 minutes down the road, etc, etc – as mentioned above. Followed by saying, I go out of the house for hospital and GP appointments only, etc, etc – as mentioned above.
I asked my mental health care coordinator if she could join me when I had the face to face assessor’s meeting, as I don’t like meeting people on my own for the first time. Also, I knew I would find the meeting very stressful, in which I was very stressed due to the amount of questions bomb-barding me, faster than lighting, it seemed! My mental health care coordinator could not believe decision maker’s final decision. Hence, she sent a factual letter to support (non-recorded post) my mandatory decision appeal. I contacted the PIP Department, in which they confirmed receipt of letter via normal postal delivery. Bearing in mind, they said that they did not receive my GP letter which I sent via recorded delivery.
Firstly, please note, that I sent all relevant documents requested by PIP, confirming my diagnosis prognosis, both physical and mental health, on completion of PIP form before they made their decision. I feel very strongly, that attaching the necessary medical notes was a complete waste of time, as DWP/PIP have chosen not to adhere to my well-being by all medical health team that are supporting me.
Secondly, last year, I was told via the DWP that mobility scooter is an aide and is part of using mobility benefit money? I was also told via the DWP that mobility monies can be used for taxi fares?
Is the above misleading comments from the DWP?
I would very much like to have your advice to the following question?
Do I have a case via the Tribunal Court?
Thank you very much B&W for your cooperation. Look forward to your reply.
J.
From 2013 – March 2015, I was on DLA Enhanced rate. February/March 2015, I appealed against the PIP decision via Mandatory Reconsideration and yet again, not qualified for the Enhance rate for mobility activities ONLY STANDARD RATE. And ENHANCED RATE for Disability Living Component. Therefore, I want to appeal against DWP PIP decision via Tribunal for Mobility Enhance rate. My indefinite chronic illnesses is to avoid any stress possible, as stress exacerbate my illnesses. My GP has written confirmation letters to both ESA and PIP, explaining that I am unable to work again. For me, this is all about principles of human rights.
Diagnosis: Granulomatosis Polyangitis with Sclerosis (February 2013). Fibromyalgia (October 2013). Followed by severe Anxiety and Depression.
Please can W&B confirm if I can appeal against the following decision to the Tribunal Court?
The following decision confirmed via PIP Decision Assessor(s):
The CQ indicates that she requires assistance for any journey due to severe anxiety or distress, she states she is very uncomfortable going outdoors because of anxiety. She is unable to consider planning any journeys because of anxiety which leads to panic attacks, she cannot use public transport due to severe anxiety and reports a traumatic past experience that affected her for a couple of days.
At the consultation, she indicated she can follow directions to a familiar and unfamiliar locations. (Face to face assessor: He said, that I seemed to be a bright woman, and should need be, could I follow a map for a journey).
(Me: I replied, by going looking on my computer, by using Google map, I would be able to see where I need to go, BUT would not carry out a journey on my own due to my mobility and anxiety. I have not been out on any journeys for a couple of years now, mainly because of my anxiety. DWP failed to note my response).
She is able to travel on *all types of public transport, without difficulty*, although she states she could only do this intellectually she couldn't do it physically or emotionally due to her anxiety and fibromyalgia. (Me: *this is a false statement - assumptions noted via the assessor. How am I able to travel journeys without difficulty, when I suffer with chronic pain and I have not travelled on all types of public transport for a couple of years?).
She will go to familiar places on her own in a taxi, she will not go to unfamiliar places on her own.
(Me: I explained to the assessor, once a month I go to see the psychiatrist for medication review via a taxi, as sometimes, I do not have a choice if my Mental Health Care Coordinator is unable to pick me up. I also go for weekly counselling sessions - both of these visits is for my Well-Being. Therefore, I go to one particular familiar place - assessor assuming I travel to other places).
She will go to the local shop on her scooter. (Me: I explained that I have a scooter on loan, and that I sometimes call in at the local shop, which is just 5 minutes away, if I've run out of milk/bread, for example. I did fail to explain to the assessor, that my journey to the shop is when it’s dark, usually half an hour before shop is closed, due to anxiety of crowd, traffic noise, and general busyness).
Assessor(s) decision, follows on:
This would be consistent with condition, diagnosis and prescribed medication.
Restriction in this area is not noted in the FME. (Me: don't know what this means?)
Therefore from the evidence and the balance of probability it would be reasonable to conclude that she would be able to plan and follow the route of a journey unaided in a reliable, safe and acceptable manner within a reasonable time frame for the majority of the time. (Me: I wish the decision maker could live one week in my shoes and then tell me, I am still able to do journeys).
Mandatory Decision - after I followed up the above:
I have looked at all the evidence again (Me: not my medical evidences, they didn't!).
I have consider the appropriate points have been awarded for all activities as shown below:
You said you have difficulties with moving around. I agree you have difficulties. (Me: But they say I have no difficulties when travelling on public transport!).
You said you have difficulties with planning and following journeys as you do not go out alone travel on public transport due to panic and severe anxiety and would be unable to follow unfamiliar routes. (Me: This is correct. As I have severe anxiety, how am I able to go out to unfamiliar routes by myself? a) my physical mobility stops me, because I am unable to walk too far by familiar routes, let alone unfamiliar places b) due to cognitive anxiety. Common sense plays a part.
This activity considers a claimants ability to plan and follow the route of a journey. A journey means, a local journey, whether that journey is familiar or unfamiliar and to go on that journey would cause overwhelming psychological distress that the person is unable to function without prompting or support from another person. On your questionnaire you stated you can go the local shops which are approx. 5 mins away on your mobility scooter (Me: this should state shop – DWP assuming shops by implying, I go to several shops at any one time. Scooter on loan, and has to be returned) and at the consultation you stated you can go out alone in a taxi. (Me: I did not say I can go out alone in a taxi. I stated I use a taxi for appointments only. I am not really alone am I? In my opinion, the taxi person, can help with my anxiety, because I am not solely travelling on my own).
As these are journeys were you have left the home unaccompanied. (Me: weekly journey appointments only, for counselling, and once a month medication psychiatrist review. I consider these journeys to be mandatory for my Well-Being. Do I have a choice?). I have decided you can manage this activity and I agree with the previous case manager’s decision.
I have limited the period of your award as your needs may change. (Me: what does this mean?).
Me: Other journeys that I stated and is not noted via PIP assessor:
• GP appointments accompanied by my brother/friend, using surgery wheel chair due to mobility and anxiety - this was mentioned, but not noted via PIP face to face, assessor.
• One/numerous hospital appointments every month since being diagnosed - imperative to have organs and bloods checked due to Granulomatosis disease. 2 man pick up via Patients Ambulance Transport, wheel chair used – this was mentioned, but not noted via PIP face to face, assessor.
• Online shopping via the internet for grocery/clothes/household products, due to mobility and anxiety of going out doors – this was mentioned, but not noted via PIP face to face, assessor.
• The scooter was on loan and belongs to a friend who runs a mobility scooter. The scooter has to be returned and scrapped due to not being road worthy, and keeps breaking down.
When the assessor arrived at my house for a face to face consultation, he would not take additional updated copy medical notes – assessor stated they are not allowed, but I could post it - in which I did so, via recorded delivery. PIP department stated that they had not received any further medical letter to support mandatory decision (I still have post office recorded delivery receipt(s)).
The assessor asked me an open-closed question and did not follow on with additional mobility activities optional questions. Here’s how the question was asked:
Assessor: “Can you follow a journey?”
Me: “No, I cannot follow a journey”.
Assessor: “OK! This is what I mean… “You seem like a bright lady, if you had to go on a journey, could you read a map to go on that journey”?
Me: “I don’t really know what you mean? Oh… I see! Well, if I was to go on a journey, I would google map the journey, but I would not go on that journey by myself, as I suffer from anxiety you see… anxiety and depression. I never really go out of the house, I’d love to, but I can’t!
Assessor: “Is that because of your anxiety, did you say?”
Me: “Yes. Urrgghhh! The thought of going out is making me feel all anxious and nauseous right now, thinking about it! No, I would definitely not do that journey, by myself”.
Assessor: “But you can plan a journey”.
Me: “Yes, I can plan a journey”.
Then I proceeded in saying that I sometimes go to the shop on my mobility scooter, which is only 5 minutes down the road, etc, etc – as mentioned above. Followed by saying, I go out of the house for hospital and GP appointments only, etc, etc – as mentioned above.
I asked my mental health care coordinator if she could join me when I had the face to face assessor’s meeting, as I don’t like meeting people on my own for the first time. Also, I knew I would find the meeting very stressful, in which I was very stressed due to the amount of questions bomb-barding me, faster than lighting, it seemed! My mental health care coordinator could not believe decision maker’s final decision. Hence, she sent a factual letter to support (non-recorded post) my mandatory decision appeal. I contacted the PIP Department, in which they confirmed receipt of letter via normal postal delivery. Bearing in mind, they said that they did not receive my GP letter which I sent via recorded delivery.
Firstly, please note, that I sent all relevant documents requested by PIP, confirming my diagnosis prognosis, both physical and mental health, on completion of PIP form before they made their decision. I feel very strongly, that attaching the necessary medical notes was a complete waste of time, as DWP/PIP have chosen not to adhere to my well-being by all medical health team that are supporting me.
Secondly, last year, I was told via the DWP that mobility scooter is an aide and is part of using mobility benefit money? I was also told via the DWP that mobility monies can be used for taxi fares?
Is the above misleading comments from the DWP?
I would very much like to have your advice to the following question?
Do I have a case via the Tribunal Court?
Thank you very much B&W for your cooperation. Look forward to your reply.
J.
Last edit: 9 years 1 month ago by . Reason: tick.
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- Gordon
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9 years 1 month ago #131701 by Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by Gordon on topic PIP Query APPEAL
JH
Welcome to the forum
In case you are not aware, your real name appears to be showing in the forum, if you want to change this then follow the instructions in the following FAQ
My full name is showing, how can I stop it?
I am sorry, but despite the detail in your post we cannot offer an opinion on whether you would meet the criteria for an enhanced award of PIP Mobility, to do so would require a far more detailed knowledge of your problems and the information in and with your claim form than is practical in an online forum.
From your post you do not seem to have problems with the physical act of walking, or if you do then they are not so restricting as to limit the distance you can walk to less than 200m, this being the case then the only way for you to qualify for the Enhanced rate of Mobility is for you to meet the requirements of the following
Going Out
f. Cannot follow the route of a familiar journey without another person, an assistance dog or an orientation aid. 12 points.
One of the key issues is the reference to a "familiar journey", from your post you seem to have no problem going to the shop on your own, I would expect this to be classed as a familiar journey.
If you believe that you can show this to be the case then you should seriously consider an appeal, however, if you do not then you may need to accept that you are only eligible for the Standard rate.
Remember, all PIP activities must be done Reliably, this means
• Safely – in a fashion that is unlikely to cause harm to themselves or to another person.
• To a necessary and appropriate standard – given the nature of the activity.
• Repeatedly – as often as is reasonably required.
If you have more questions, then please reply to this post and we will do our best to help.
Gordon
Welcome to the forum
In case you are not aware, your real name appears to be showing in the forum, if you want to change this then follow the instructions in the following FAQ
My full name is showing, how can I stop it?
I am sorry, but despite the detail in your post we cannot offer an opinion on whether you would meet the criteria for an enhanced award of PIP Mobility, to do so would require a far more detailed knowledge of your problems and the information in and with your claim form than is practical in an online forum.
From your post you do not seem to have problems with the physical act of walking, or if you do then they are not so restricting as to limit the distance you can walk to less than 200m, this being the case then the only way for you to qualify for the Enhanced rate of Mobility is for you to meet the requirements of the following
Going Out
f. Cannot follow the route of a familiar journey without another person, an assistance dog or an orientation aid. 12 points.
One of the key issues is the reference to a "familiar journey", from your post you seem to have no problem going to the shop on your own, I would expect this to be classed as a familiar journey.
If you believe that you can show this to be the case then you should seriously consider an appeal, however, if you do not then you may need to accept that you are only eligible for the Standard rate.
Remember, all PIP activities must be done Reliably, this means
• Safely – in a fashion that is unlikely to cause harm to themselves or to another person.
• To a necessary and appropriate standard – given the nature of the activity.
• Repeatedly – as often as is reasonably required.
If you have more questions, then please reply to this post and we will do our best to help.
Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
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- jb
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9 years 1 month ago #131743 by jb
Replied by jb on topic PIP Query APPEAL
I am unable to walk without an aide to the shop. I can only walk between 20 - 50 mtrs, using a walking stick for balance in which I use the house. I really don't understand the term familiar route points system, if one has known the area before becoming ill. On the other hand, I know the town centre, but will cannot go to town on my own because I don't like crowds, noise, this is wear my anxiety kicks in, even though I have been familiar with this area all my life. Also, how am I to go out on my own when my physical health is deteriorated by Fibromyalgia. Scooter has mechanic problems and is on loan... friend is going to scrap scooter, soon. What will happen when my appointments ceases to go via taxi. I only feel safe when I am with someone. Can you also delete my post, if it is not going to help me to appeal. Thank you.
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- Gordon
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9 years 1 month ago #131745 by Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by Gordon on topic PIP Query APPEAL
jb
If you also have problems with walking then you have more options available to you to score the 12 points required for an Enhanced award as you can try to score extra points from both the Going Out Descriptor and the Moving Around one.
What points did you score for these two Descriptors on your Standard award?
Gordon
If you also have problems with walking then you have more options available to you to score the 12 points required for an Enhanced award as you can try to score extra points from both the Going Out Descriptor and the Moving Around one.
What points did you score for these two Descriptors on your Standard award?
Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
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- jb
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9 years 1 month ago #131747 by jb
Replied by jb on topic PIP Query APPEAL
Hello Gordon
I got a score of 10 on Moving around. The planning and following journey I got 0.
I just don't understand the question: You can plan and follow a route unaided?
What do they mean by unaided?
They ended the decision with the following:
I have limited the period of your award as your needs may change. What are they saying here exactly?
Regards Jb
I got a score of 10 on Moving around. The planning and following journey I got 0.
I just don't understand the question: You can plan and follow a route unaided?
What do they mean by unaided?
They ended the decision with the following:
I have limited the period of your award as your needs may change. What are they saying here exactly?
Regards Jb
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9 years 1 month ago #131751 by caravanj
Replied by caravanj on topic PIP Query APPEAL
To answer your question about your mobility allowance, it's primary purpose is to provide you with money to be able to get out & about by whatever means you choose.
From your post you have demonstrated that you can, & do, follow a familiar route by being able to go to the shop on a scooter & the DWP may well take the view that you should continue to use one in order to get to the shop.
You will lose points for not using any available aid to help you to perform a task so merely saying you can't go to the shop because you won't replace your sccooter may not help your case.
As per what Gordon has advised, you may wish to have a look at question 11e on the PIP test link & see if that applies to you.
www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/pip/indexxx.php
From your post you have demonstrated that you can, & do, follow a familiar route by being able to go to the shop on a scooter & the DWP may well take the view that you should continue to use one in order to get to the shop.
You will lose points for not using any available aid to help you to perform a task so merely saying you can't go to the shop because you won't replace your sccooter may not help your case.
As per what Gordon has advised, you may wish to have a look at question 11e on the PIP test link & see if that applies to you.
www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/pip/indexxx.php
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