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TOPIC: Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring

Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring 5 days 4 hours ago #240106

My son needs and gets 24 hour supervision,
But the DWP have only given him 9 points for pip Living as they claim it’s all about the amount of time he is fitting, not the supervision he needs between fits. The gp and consultant both say he must have 24 hour supervision to prevent extra injury when fits happen. His seizures are severe, possibly life threatening, and without any warning. My son is 30 and 6ft 5”. How do I persuade them to increase his points? Without High rate Living, he can’t get a 2 bed flat, won’t be able to have overnight care and will have to continue to live at home for ever. He has had high rate care DLA for 15 years...all advice very gratefully received.

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Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring 5 days 2 hours ago #240112

Hi HJH

First of all, have you looked at our PIP Claim guide?

www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/help-for-claimants/pip

We can't tell you which of the activities you should aim for and what you should write, our role is to make sure that you have the information and understanding to make these decisions yourself.

The first stage to challenging a Decision is for you to request a Mandatory Reconsideration, this needs to be done in writing to the DWP, within one month of the Decision, to the office that dealt with your claim, have a look at our PIP Mandatory Reconsideration & Appeal guide for details of the process, the PIP area also has template letters that you can use to make the request with.

Contact DWP and ask for a copy of the assessment report (PA4) if you have not already done so, I would phone them but again follow up the request in writing. Once you have the assessment report you will have a better understanding of how the DWP Decision Maker has come to their conclusions and will then be able to argue against them.

Your primary task is to show that you meet the criteria, there are many reasons you may have failed, you need to address each of these but don't get bogged down in criticising the assessment report unless you can clearly show that it is incorrect, it is a lot easier to argue the facts of the situation;

"the assessor recorded that I walked 50m, I did but they have failed to document that I had to stop every 10m for a rest due to breathlessness"

than their opinions

"based on my observations of the claimant walking I believe that they can reliably walk more than 200m.

What you have to remember is that DLA descriptors are different to PIP, PIP is a lot more stricter especially mobility component.

When you have a better idea of the issues with your claim, come back to the forum and we will do our best to help.

Gary

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Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Last edit: by Gary.

Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring 1 day 14 hours ago #240196

Hi Gary,
Thank you for your help.
We have been using the guides, and have been awarded high rate mobility, but only 9 points for daily living. We went through the mandatory review and had a ridiculous response, changing nothing and justifying the 3 yr time limit on the grounds of limited right to remain when my son was born in the Uk, has a full Uk passport and no one in this family has even lived abroad for more than a fortnight on holiday! What I’m really trying to ascertain is when is supervision and assistance no longer supervision and assistance, but something much more? Eg is pulling someone unconscious and fitting out of a shower cubicle merely supervision and assistance? Our tribunal hearing is Thursday this week, and the DWP only responded to our appeal 10 days ago, so I’m having to do a lot of last minute responses to new DWP arguments.

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Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring 1 day 13 hours ago #240202

Hi HJH

In terms of asssistance and supervision - it normally refers to help on an ongoing basis for help with daily living. Fitting out a shower cubicle is a one off - and thought someone may need to arrange for the work to be done for a claimant - the DWP will not care - because it does not fit into the criteria. They will only be interested in the help someone needs to use the shower.

In terms of pulling someone who is unconscious from a shower unit - this is emergency assistance. The question would be how often this happens to the person. If it happens nearly every time they shower - it is entirely relevant - if they need the assistance - to prevent it from happening - it's entirely relevant - if it has only happened once - but it has prevented them having a shower - then it is still relevant. Only you know why the assistance or supervision is needed.

BIS

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Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring 16 hours 38 minutes ago #240236

Oh dear! Linguistic problems. I didn’t mean fitting out a shower cubicle, I meant we sometimes have to pull our son out of the shower when he has a seizure and is fitting.
If he showers alone, he could have a fit and die. It’s the most common cause of death in people with my sons type of epilepsy. So we always need to be close by whilst he showers. Is this merely supervision,? Is the need to be close by in case we need to get him out assistance? Or is it more than that?

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Drs say son needs 24 hour supervision & monitoring 15 hours 27 minutes ago #240238

Hi HJH

Sorry that I misunderstood what you said. I think you are trying to think this too deeply - I don't know what you are trying to say when you ask is it more than assistance or supervision - under the DWP criteria - there is nothing else.

1. Under the PIP criteria - you always have to be in the vicinity when your son showers, because he is at high risk of fitting, and you need to highlight what the GP and Consultant have said to back this up. He cannot do this task, safely or reliably. They may well ask you about triggers, or how often he fits. He needs constant supervision - (to be there if he fits) and he needs assistance (when he fits) and you need to highlight the difficulties of helping someone who is 6 ft 5 in a confined space (even if it is a wet room). Have you any medical evidence which backs up what you have said about the most common cause of death for his type of epilepsy? If you have any medical papers which you didn't submit - take it along with you.

2. Clearly it is not just in the shower where your son is at risk. I don't know where else your son scored points (or didn't score them), but in areas like preparing a meal - I assume if the GP and consultant are saying he needs 24 hr supervision, then he is at great risk doing any type of cooking activity and if you haven't already you need to highlight this.

3. Because of the nature of your son's condition - you need to highlight that saying he only needs supervision when he actually has a seizure is unreasonable and unrealistic. Unless you know that he is only going to fit at particular times of day - then the supervision needs to cover the 24hrs as highlighted by your experts.

4. The biggest issue you will be fighting from the little you have said is likely to be the frequency of his attacks. If he rarely has one - because his condition is well controlled by medication - the DWP will argue that the need for supervision is reduced. (Not saying they are right - just may be what they will argue). However, if you are lucky no one will turn up and you will be able to explain yourselves.

Good luck

BIS

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