Benefit query

Marie wrote:

bro58 wrote: Hi M,

I think that you are somewhat confused !

Yes I am confused perhaps because I am tired the way the DWP is treating my friend

"Is that a contribution benefit or non contribution benefit?"

NI Credits are simply a weekly NI "Credit/Stamp" that goes towards your State Pension.

You receive NI Credits with ESA, whether it be CB ESA, IR ESA, or indeed a "nil rate" award of ESA when your 365 days entitlement to CB ESA has been exhausted and you are not entitled to any IR ESA.

The DWP has not say what type of ESA benefit that's why our confusions the letter just says:-
We will credit you with National Insurance Contributions while claiming Employment and Support Allowance . There is nothing in the letters about ESA Income-Related whether she is entitled or not.

For ESA to be in payment whilst in The WRAG after exhausting the 365 days entitlement to payment of CB ESA, one would have to pass the means test for entitlement to payment of IR ESA.

Mean tested as in savings? or money coming in the DWP has been made aware of my friend financial, she has no savings what so ever just her work pension of £60 a week which I saw in your post to the other poster if her pension exceed the amount of £85 or if she is in receipt of ESA IR she then have to pay £ for £ etc.

Thank you again

bro58

Hi M,


"The DWP has not say what type of ESA benefit that's why our confusions the letter just says:-
We will credit you with National Insurance Contributions while claiming Employment and Support Allowance . There is nothing in the letters about ESA Income-Related whether she is entitled or not."

We need to answer some basic questions here :

1. Is your friend still in The WRAG of ESA ?

2. Is your friend receiving any Monetary Payments of ESA ?


"Mean tested as in savings? or money coming in the DWP has been made aware of my friend financial, she has no savings what so ever just her work pension of £60 a week which I saw in your post to the other poster if her pension exceed the amount of £85 or if she is in receipt of ESA IR she then have to pay £ for £ etc."


If your friend is still in The WRAG, she cannot possibly be receiving CB ESA payments after one year.

Therefore the £85/Week disregard rule for Works Pensions and CB ESA is not relevant.

If she is/was entitled to any IR ESA payments, then the £60/Week would be deducted/offset £ for £ from any weekly IR ESA entitlement that she may have.

The IR ESA means test covers, capital, assets, savings, household income and any hours worked by a partner if you have one, as explained in the blue links supplied on this post, re : IR ESA :

www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/forum?view=top...&mesid=128126#128105

If your friend is not receiving any IR ESA payments, and is still in the WRAG and her only household income is £60/Week then she may be entitled to an IR ESA top-up, dependent on their age.

Current ESA WRAG rates :

Personal Allowance single - under 25 = £57.35
+
Work Related Activity Group Component = £28.75

Total = £86.10

With £60/Week income this would give a weekly IR ESA entitlement of £26.10/Week

Or

Personal Allowance single - 25 or over = £72.40
+
Work Related Activity Group Component = £28.75

Total = £101.15/Week

With £60/Week income this would give a weekly IR ESA entitlement of £41.15/Week

See : Benefit Rates 2014

As it seems that your friend was sucessfully transferred over from Incapacity Benefit (IB) to ESA, you may find our : IB, IS, SDA, Migration to ESA FAQ’s of interest.

These may give you some idea of any entitlement that your friend may have but they are no substitute for face to face advice :

Benefits Calculator

Benefits Calculator

If you feel that your friend has entitlement to IR ESA and is/has not received payment, you should write to The DWP informing them of this.

bro58

Please can you advice by what you mean 'MONETARY PAYMENTS'

My friend is receiving £105.00 per week which is paid fortnightly in her bank account.

Is that what you mean by MONETARY PAYMENTS, money is being paid by the DWP If so does that mean that she does have to take part in the WFI?

She is not in receipt of ESA IR
ESA CB

Thank you.

Marie wrote: Please can you advice by what you mean 'MONETARY PAYMENTS'

My friend is receiving £105.00 per week which is paid fortnightly in her bank account.

Is that what you mean by MONETARY PAYMENTS, money is being paid by the DWP If so does that mean that she does have to take part in the WFI?

She is not in receipt of ESA IR
ESA CB

Thank you.

Hi M,

"MONETARY PAYMENTS" would mean any payments of monies, as opposed to the crediting of NI "Stamps" (Credits) only.

If she is receiving these payments into her bank account what else do you think that these payments are if they are not ESA ?

If she is still in The WRAG, these payments must be IR ESA.

Are you sure that the DWP are aware of the £60/Week Works Pension that she receives ?

Another alternative, is that she has been reassessed and placed into The SG, in which case, the payments would be CB ESA.

If this was the case, then that would explain why there were no deductions being made for the £60/Week Pension, as it is below £85/Week.

As it seems that she is receiving "MONETARY PAYMENTS" of ESA, she would have to comply with any WRA or WFI or risk Sanctioning of her payments.

Unless of course you find out that she is in The SG in which case participation in WRA/WFI is purely voluntary.

A starting point may be to ring The ESA Number, as early as possible :

THE ESA PHONE NUMBER DWP : 0345 608 8545 Press Option 3 for ESA.

To try and ascertain what group of ESA she is in, and what payments she is receiving.

If necessary, you could request an escalation to a Manager/Supervisor which will involve a call back.

An indication that your friend is in receipt of ESA would be the pay reference for the fortnightly payments going into her bank account.

For ESA, it generally has the NI Number then something like EESA.

Are the payments exactly £105/Week ?

I am really struggling to offer accurate advice, due to the confusing and contradictory information that you are providing.

However, I will continue to endeavour to do my best !!

bro58

bro58 wrote:

Marie wrote: Please can you advice by what you mean 'MONETARY PAYMENTS'

My friend is receiving £105.00 per week which is paid fortnightly in her bank account.

Is that what you mean by MONETARY PAYMENTS, money is being paid by the DWP If so does that mean that she does have to take part in the WFI?

She is not in receipt of ESA IR
ESA CB

Thank you.

Hi M,

"MONETARY PAYMENTS" would mean any payments of monies, as opposed to the crediting of NI "Stamps" (Credits) only.

If she is receiving these payments into her bank account what else do you think that these payments are if they are not ESA ?

If she is still in The WRAG, these payments must be IR ESA.

Are you sure that the DWP are aware of the £60/Week Works Pension that she receives ?

Another alternative, is that she has been reassessed and placed into The SG, in which case, the payments would be CB ESA.

If this was the case, then that would explain why there were no deductions being made for the £60/Week Pension, as it is below £85/Week.

As it seems that she is receiving "MONETARY PAYMENTS" of ESA, she would have to comply with any WRA or WFI or risk Sanctioning of her payments.

Unless of course you find out that she is in The SG in which case participation in WRA/WFI is purely voluntary.

A starting point may be to ring The ESA Number, as early as possible :

THE ESA PHONE NUMBER DWP : 0345 608 8545 Press Option 3 for ESA.

To try and ascertain what group of ESA she is in, and what payments she is receiving.

If necessary, you could request an escalation to a Manager/Supervisor which will involve a call back.

An indication that your friend is in receipt of ESA would be the pay reference for the fortnightly payments going into her bank account.

For ESA, it generally has the NI Number then something like EESA.

Are the payments exactly £105/Week ?

I am really struggling to offer accurate advice, due to the confusing and contradictory information that you are providing.

However, I will continue to endeavour to do my best !!

bro58

Thank you so much for your valuable advices, please excuse my long delays in replying to my thread I have been very ill for the last two weeks and still not 100%.

Since my last post I found out my friend is in receipt of ESA IR, she has an occupational pension of £240.00 per month. Yes the DWP is aware of the pension and also Inland Revenue would have inform them because I spoke to Inland Revenue on her behalf about her pension, Inland Revenue also told me the DWP did not tell them that my friend was not receiving any benefit. She was forced to take her pension early to survive on because DWP stopped her benefit long story I'm still fighting for.

Would it be possible if you could explain how the deductions are worked out on £200.00 ESA IR fortnightly.

Are there guidance I can read about occupational pension deduction and ESA IR?

Thank you

Marie wrote:

bro58 wrote:

Marie wrote: Please can you advice by what you mean 'MONETARY PAYMENTS'

My friend is receiving £105.00 per week which is paid fortnightly in her bank account.

Is that what you mean by MONETARY PAYMENTS, money is being paid by the DWP If so does that mean that she does have to take part in the WFI?

She is not in receipt of ESA IR
ESA CB

Thank you.

Hi M,

"MONETARY PAYMENTS" would mean any payments of monies, as opposed to the crediting of NI "Stamps" (Credits) only.

If she is receiving these payments into her bank account what else do you think that these payments are if they are not ESA ?

If she is still in The WRAG, these payments must be IR ESA.

Are you sure that the DWP are aware of the £60/Week Works Pension that she receives ?

Another alternative, is that she has been reassessed and placed into The SG, in which case, the payments would be CB ESA.

If this was the case, then that would explain why there were no deductions being made for the £60/Week Pension, as it is below £85/Week.

As it seems that she is receiving "MONETARY PAYMENTS" of ESA, she would have to comply with any WRA or WFI or risk Sanctioning of her payments.

Unless of course you find out that she is in The SG in which case participation in WRA/WFI is purely voluntary.

A starting point may be to ring The ESA Number, as early as possible :

THE ESA PHONE NUMBER DWP : 0345 608 8545 Press Option 3 for ESA.

To try and ascertain what group of ESA she is in, and what payments she is receiving.

If necessary, you could request an escalation to a Manager/Supervisor which will involve a call back.

An indication that your friend is in receipt of ESA would be the pay reference for the fortnightly payments going into her bank account.

For ESA, it generally has the NI Number then something like EESA.

Are the payments exactly £105/Week ?

I am really struggling to offer accurate advice, due to the confusing and contradictory information that you are providing.

However, I will continue to endeavour to do my best !!

bro58

Thank you so much for your valuable advices, please excuse my long delays in replying to my thread I have been very ill for the last two weeks and still not 100%.

Since my last post I found out my friend is in receipt of ESA IR, she has an occupational pension of £240.00 per month. Yes the DWP is aware of the pension and also Inland Revenue would have inform them because I spoke to Inland Revenue on her behalf about her pension, Inland Revenue also told me the DWP did not tell them that my friend was not receiving any benefit. She was forced to take her pension early to survive on because DWP stopped her benefit long story I'm still fighting for.

Would it be possible if you could explain how the deductions are worked out on £200.00 ESA IR fortnightly.

Are there guidance I can read about occupational pension deduction and ESA IR?

Thank you

Hi M,

Are you absolutely sure that your friend is in receipt of IR ESA payments ?

Further, are you absolutely sure that The DWP are aware that they are in receipt of a Works Pension ? (OP)

You cannot rely on the fact that HMRC know about the OP and have therefore informed The DWP, no more than you can rely on The DWP informing HMRC of relevant facts.

It is always up to the individual to take all reasonable steps to inform such bodies of any relevant facts.

With regards to IR ESA entitlement to payment, I explained it, and provided blue information links : Here.

With IR ESA the way that deductions are made with respect to any household income such as an Occupational Pension (OP) are quite simple.

You start with your total amount or IR ESA that you are entitled to, then you deduct any household income such as an OP from that entitlement £ for £.

e.g. Your total IR ESA entitlement is £101.15/Week, your applicable household income is £80/Week.

The £80/Week would be deducted from the £101.15/Week which would mean that would actual receive an IR ESA payment of £21.15/Week. (£101.15 - £80 = £21.15)

Using the £101.15/Week figure above, if your weekly household income exceeded that amount, e.g. £105/Week, this would wipe out the £101.15/Week IR ESA entitlement, and you would not receive any IR ESA payments.

With Income Related ESA, the clue is in the name, any payment of it is "Related" to any other household "Income" that you may have, it is means tested as opposed to Contribution Based (CB) ESA which is not means tested.

There is however a rule with CB ESA when you are also entitled to payment of an OP.

If your OP exceeds £85/Week any excess of this figure is deducted from your weekly CB ESA entitlement by 50 pence in the pound.

e.g. Weekly CB ESA entitlement is £101.15/Week, OP is £105/Week.

This gives you an excess on your OP of £20/Week which is then deducted at a rate of 50% of this excess which is £10.

Therefore £101.15/Week CB ESA - £10 (50% excess) means that your CB ESA weekly payments would be £91.15/Week

£101.15-£10 = £91.15.

If you have any doubts that the DWP are unaware of the full facts, I would inform the relevant ESA office in writing.

I would even advise this where a claimants is in receipt of CB ESA, and their OP does not exceed the £85/Week :

Sending Documents to the DWP or ATOS

Benefit Rates 2014

bro58

Hi M,

I have remade the format of your post, as the other contained so many previous post quotes, making it difficult to read

If you are to use the quote button, only quote the previous post, and write your own comments below the quote.

Marie wrote:

"MONETARY PAYMENTS" would mean any payments of monies, as opposed to the crediting of NI "Stamps" (Credits) only.

If she is receiving these payments into her bank account what else do you think that these payments are if they are not ESA ?

Only Occupational Pension goes into her bank account, she has no other bank account also.

"If she is still in The WRAG, these payments must be IR ESA."

Yes my friend is receiving IR ESA

"Are you sure that the DWP are aware of the £60/Week Works Pension that she receives ?"

Yes the DWP are aware I have shown the DWP my friend pension letter from the pension people and what she gets per month they were also given bank statement 6 months worth. My friend was called for a Customer Compliance Officer, Office interview, her benefit stopped illegally, she was forced to take out her pension to survive on when she received her pension she was not receiving any benefits at all after I threatening the DWP with legal actions they put all her money back from December 2014 right up to November 2015 but the overpayment the CCO said was from 21st November that's when her benefit was reinstated the problem is the CCO shouted at me when I said I want to talk about the overpayment because they know the error lies with them when she'd asked how the overpayment or fraud started and for how long. lol the CCO insisted my friend was called to check she was receiving the right benefit and not for overpayment the CCO also abandon the interview and would not take the statement I wrote for the MF47 hers was a lot of lies.

"Another alternative, is that she has been reassessed and placed into The SG, in which case, the payments would be CB ESA."

I'm going to try and get her back in the SG, I have not heard anything from the DWP since the CCO interview last Wednesday, I'm sure if my friend did not have valuable evident, her benefit would have been stopped once again because the person reinstated her benefit did not pass information to the relevant person hence! the fraud CCO interview she was shocked when I showed her evident.

"If this was the case, then that would explain why there were no deductions being made for the £60/Week Pension, as it is below £85/Week."

No I believe they haven't deduct because they wanted to cut her off benefit instead. I've gather from your advice IR ESA, one's money get reduced if any other money coming in the bank account be it pensions, savings etc.

"As it seems that she is receiving "MONETARY PAYMENTS" of ESA, she would have to comply with any WRA or WFI or risk Sanctioning of her payments."

Yes I've made her aware and I will be accompany her as usual. The DWP cancelled her last WFI without even sending a letter explaining why, because by then her benefit was stopped so it looks like history may repeat itself we will know by Friday this week she is due for her benefit money coming in.

"Unless of course you find out that she is in The SG in which case participation in WRA/WFI is purely voluntary."

No she is not in the SG definitely receiving WRAG ESA IR

"A starting point may be to ring The ESA Number, as early as possible :

THE ESA PHONE NUMBER DWP : 0345 608 8545 Press Option 3 for ESA.

To try and ascertain what group of ESA she is in, and what payments she is receiving.

If necessary, you could request an escalation to a Manager/Supervisor which will involve a call back."

I have tried to ring the DWP since my friend benefit was reinstated to tell them about her pensions, I'd already rang Inland Revenue but when I asked for the JobCentre Manager name I was rudely spoken to and was told they will not give out Managers name they also refused to put me through the WFI Adviser, even though my friend said to the lady on the phone I can speak on her behalf they were rude with her and me then put the phone down. I was forced to go to that Jobcentre Plus and hand the WFI Adviser a letter by hand. Again in the JobCentre Plus Office they will not give me name of the person responsible.



As mentioned above the CCO Officer when I asked her how do a person report any changes when staff are rude and said they do not give out Managers names that's when she shouted at me and said there was no overpayment the CCO interview was to check if my friend is receiving the right benefit. The CCO also tried to get me to sign some appointee form, apply for carer's allowance because of my friend but I was having none of it, she went mad when I stopped her from asking my friends about her medications and health I didn't think the CCO appointment was about Medical health and when I advice my friend not to sign the MF47 because I intended to write the whole statement myself the CCO slammed the door and walked off, I had to hand the statements to other member of staff. On my new grand son's life I tell you no lie it is all the truth.

"An indication that your friend is in receipt of ESA would be the pay reference for the fortnightly payments going into her bank account."

Yes it is fortnightly

"For ESA, it generally has the NI Number then something like EESA."

Yes have EESA we do not a clue what that mean

"Are the payments exactly £105/Week ? "

The letter says your Income Related is £101.15 per week but it is paid fortnightly.

"I am really struggling to offer accurate advice, due to the confusing and contradictory information that you are providing."

We do apologies for causing confusions, we are very confused ourselves.

The story goes benefit stopped 29th December 2013 no letter from the dwp, got MP involved, Ombudsman, no help from either benefit was reinstate because I said my friend will be taking legal action under the Fraud Act 2006.

Money was put back and benefit esa IR was reinstated on November 21st 2014. 3rd December 2014 got a CCO letter for a fraud interview for the 9th December another letter arrive for a WFI for the 9th December 2014. So two appointments one for the Fraud Office one for the WFI both on the 9th December 2014 at the same time long story there.

Same day money was put back in bank account same day an ESA50 form arrived lol so now you can see how confused and stress both my friend and I are under. we've spent the whole of 2014 fighting to get her benefit back, times was very hard financially, I was supporting her on my IS benefit money.

"However, I will continue to endeavour to do my best !! "

My friend and I both very much appreciate your help and thank you very much. One consolation forum like this do help. We wait for Friday the 6th February this week to see what the outcome.


Marie