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Confusion over PIP

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7 years 9 months ago #165053 by Gordon
Replied by Gordon on topic Confusion over PIP
FMS

It can be very difficult to read how an assessment has actually gone, I've given up trying to.

PIP Decisions are currently taking about 8 weeks so I'm afraid there may be a few more fraught days until you hear.

Gordon

Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems

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7 years 9 months ago #166263 by FMS
Replied by FMS on topic Confusion over PIP
Well my Decision Letter arrived this morning - exactly 4 weeks to the day after my assessment. The DM has followed the Assessor's recommendations and awarded 11 points. As I posted a couple of weeks ago, after my assessment I thought I would be awarded 0 points so this is a good outcome and is due in no small part to the help from Gordon and the Member Guides.

However, all my points were awarded on: (b) Needs to use an aid or appliance to be able to .... which awards 2 points apart from 'Monitoring Health Conditions' under which (b) awards 1 point. This is despite the fact that I told the HP that I can't use aids due to to my reduced grip etc. In my opinion 'assistance' is required rather than 'aids'.

I am also dismayed that the HP has used, as justification for all her descriptor choices that, 'I was able to hand over paperwork' and 'I still drive'.

My husband placed the paperwork from his bag onto the table; I then slid across the table a new medical report for her attention - this did not require me to pick it up or grip it. The only time I gripped a piece of paper was at the conclusion when she handed me an ATOS leaflet. Obviously, this is not heavy item and, although it did not fall out of my hand, the probability is that it she had done it a number of times then I would have dropped it around 50% of the time.

With regard to me being able to drive - I told her that on the very few occasions when I do drive our automatic car (which is only on good days, roughly 3 times a month) I am not confident and I need someone to pull on the handbrake. She mentions this under 'Social and Occupation History' but still uses it as justification for her descriptor choices. I should have made clear that in our automatic car there is no gripping required only a slight push/pull mechanism with my hand and arm resting on the gear stick and little effort is required in terms of 'dexterity and grip', One of my main problems is that things fall out of my grip but a gear stick can't fall! Again, I didn't think I needed to explain this but I should have even although under 'Musculoskeletal system' she states things like 'Wrist movements stiff and reduced; upper limb power reduced; dexterity and pinch grip all reduced in both hands.'

Is it possible to phone the DM and ask if they can specify the aid(s) they think I should be able to use in Activity 1, 4 and 6 as these are the ones which I most disagree with?

I suspect that I will have to request an MR (and possibly be awarded fewer points) as I would feel uncomfortable accepting a favourable decision when I specifically told the HP that I don't use aids!

Any thoughts?

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7 years 9 months ago #166273 by Gordon
Replied by Gordon on topic Confusion over PIP
FMS

Forgive me if I am blunt, if you think that you should score the extra points for an Enhanced award, then this is something to consider, if you are going to ask for an MR so that the correct descriptors are used (in your opinion), with no intention of increasing your points total, then I would say that you are risking all for no perceived benefit. Ask yourself how you will feel if you lose your current award?

To pick up on a couple of points you raised in your post from this afternoon and playing Devil's Advocate.

First of all you are arguing with the assessors opinions, I'm not suggesting that they don't get it wrong, quite the opposite, but this is someone has been trained to do disability assessments and possibly has 100s of assessments under their belt, their opinion is going to carry some weight.

Picking up a pan of boiling water, the DWP will argue that there is no need for you to do this, that you can use a slotted spoon to remove the food from the pan on to a plate and can then leave the pan to cool.

Even though you say you only drive a few times a month, the fact that you do suggests good arm strength and an ability to grip the steering wheel for prolonged periods of time, whether you agree with it or not, your ability to do this would appear to a reasonable person to be at odds with your limitations for the rest of the time.

The decision is of course yours and we will try and support you which ever way you go, but I urge you to think carefully about this.

Gordon

Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
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7 years 9 months ago #166288 by nonsmoker2008
Replied by nonsmoker2008 on topic Confusion over PIP

Gordon wrote:
Picking up a pan of boiling water, the DWP will argue that there is no need for you to do this, that you can use a slotted spoon to remove the food from the pan on to a plate and can then leave the pan to cool.

Gordon


If I may devils advocate upon your devils advocate... Forget the whole boiling water bit, if you have reduced grip and strength how is one supposed to carry a pan filled with water from the tap to the hob? I know I can't without slopping it everywhere, including the floor, or dropping it altogether. Surely spilt water all over the floor should be considered just as much a danger?

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7 years 9 months ago #166289 by Gordon
Replied by Gordon on topic Confusion over PIP

nonsmoker2008 wrote: If I may devils advocate upon your devils advocate... Forget the whole boiling water bit, if you have reduced grip and strength how is one supposed to carry a pan filled with water from the tap to the hob? I know I can't without slopping it everywhere, including the floor, or dropping it altogether. Surely spilt water all over the floor should be considered just as much a danger?


Unfortunately the DWP have thought of this as well, there is no need for a claimant to do this, they can place an empty pan on the hob and use a small and manageable container to fill it with water.

Gordon

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