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PIP tribunal appeal advice re MH court ruling
- jim555
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5 years 3 months ago #242738 by jim555
Replied by jim555 on topic PIP tribunal appeal advice re MH court ruling
Thanks BIS, i feel i am making progress, albeit slowly and not at the desired rate.
Ii have a question in relation to the appeal process and the possible people that could be involved in respect to representative, appointee, advocate, solicitor etc etc. I would just like someone to shed some light on this area if possible...
So at present I have a CAB member willing to be my representative. Thus far I have mentioned my limitations and restrictions in regard to attending an oral hearing in person, so paper based submission is the current understanding and understood by both parties.
The path I would like to explore is if, I could ask the CAB member if they would be willing to attend my oral hearing as my representative on my behalf? Does this happen, can it happen if the CAB member is willing? I am more than happy to cover their travel expenses and anything else involved. I do understand that the chances of successful appeal are significantly higher for oral hearings compared to paper based and also that with a representative your success rate is even higher. Am I right, that if the CAB member agrees to represent me in my absence at an oral hearing my success rate is potentially around 60-70% compared to a dismal 5-19% with the paper based?
I am also wondering if anyone else involved with a review of their mobility award due to the MH court ruling agrees or shares my view on the following..?
- The advantage is very much supporting the DWP in the sense of fairly reviewing old PIP claims relating to the MH court ruling.
- The high court ruled the DWP was discriminating against many mental health claimants and demanded the DWP reviewed and corrected the wrong awards as a result
- At the time of unlawful wording on relevant mobility descriptors, claimants were wrongly awarded incorrect descriptors resulting in incorrect awards.
- Claimants applying or filling out PIP questionairres at this point in time, would have been looking at the relevant descriptors applicable to them and wording their information and obtaining and submitting evidence to support those related circumstances and descriptors.
- The HCP and Decision maker would have been dismissing or not elaborating on potentially relevant information or evidence at the assessment period specifically relating to descriptors including or excluding, OPD relevance, on numerous mobility descriptors.
- At no point of the High court ruling was every potential claimant contacted and asked If they felt their PIP mobility claim could be affected by the changes in law ( take this one on the chin ) but as a result claimants were just expected to accept the DWP made unlawful changes to descriptors resulting in unlawful mobility awards and to just sit back and wait and have faith in the DWP accurately reviewing, asking the claimant for additional evidence if required and trust implicitly, DWP righting all the historical wrongs.
- What penalties or sanctions were imposed by the high court, should DWP not accurately review and apply the correct PIP law to each and every claimant affected? ( If nothing then I should take every review and subsequent MR decision with significant doubt correct law and review was applied accurately. )
- Should DWP not be heavily fined if a claimants case, following on from a MH and RF review- then a MR not awarded- then at a tribunal appeal and claimant be successful and the appeal? How many times can the DWP act unlawfully and discriminate against MH claimants and go unpunished?
- Even if appeal is won at tribunal or even review or MR stage... monetary value i guess can be reinstated/ back dated but what about the access to the mobility scheme many claimants rely heavily upon and the impact of that absence in relation to their already poor mental health, financially and the impact upon, general day to day living?
The above is a few examples but by no means comprehensive. Should the independent tribunal panel at least take these above points into consideration during appeal or am I just in a cloud, way up high with my twisted views and opinions?
Jim
-
Ii have a question in relation to the appeal process and the possible people that could be involved in respect to representative, appointee, advocate, solicitor etc etc. I would just like someone to shed some light on this area if possible...
So at present I have a CAB member willing to be my representative. Thus far I have mentioned my limitations and restrictions in regard to attending an oral hearing in person, so paper based submission is the current understanding and understood by both parties.
The path I would like to explore is if, I could ask the CAB member if they would be willing to attend my oral hearing as my representative on my behalf? Does this happen, can it happen if the CAB member is willing? I am more than happy to cover their travel expenses and anything else involved. I do understand that the chances of successful appeal are significantly higher for oral hearings compared to paper based and also that with a representative your success rate is even higher. Am I right, that if the CAB member agrees to represent me in my absence at an oral hearing my success rate is potentially around 60-70% compared to a dismal 5-19% with the paper based?
I am also wondering if anyone else involved with a review of their mobility award due to the MH court ruling agrees or shares my view on the following..?
- The advantage is very much supporting the DWP in the sense of fairly reviewing old PIP claims relating to the MH court ruling.
- The high court ruled the DWP was discriminating against many mental health claimants and demanded the DWP reviewed and corrected the wrong awards as a result
- At the time of unlawful wording on relevant mobility descriptors, claimants were wrongly awarded incorrect descriptors resulting in incorrect awards.
- Claimants applying or filling out PIP questionairres at this point in time, would have been looking at the relevant descriptors applicable to them and wording their information and obtaining and submitting evidence to support those related circumstances and descriptors.
- The HCP and Decision maker would have been dismissing or not elaborating on potentially relevant information or evidence at the assessment period specifically relating to descriptors including or excluding, OPD relevance, on numerous mobility descriptors.
- At no point of the High court ruling was every potential claimant contacted and asked If they felt their PIP mobility claim could be affected by the changes in law ( take this one on the chin ) but as a result claimants were just expected to accept the DWP made unlawful changes to descriptors resulting in unlawful mobility awards and to just sit back and wait and have faith in the DWP accurately reviewing, asking the claimant for additional evidence if required and trust implicitly, DWP righting all the historical wrongs.
- What penalties or sanctions were imposed by the high court, should DWP not accurately review and apply the correct PIP law to each and every claimant affected? ( If nothing then I should take every review and subsequent MR decision with significant doubt correct law and review was applied accurately. )
- Should DWP not be heavily fined if a claimants case, following on from a MH and RF review- then a MR not awarded- then at a tribunal appeal and claimant be successful and the appeal? How many times can the DWP act unlawfully and discriminate against MH claimants and go unpunished?
- Even if appeal is won at tribunal or even review or MR stage... monetary value i guess can be reinstated/ back dated but what about the access to the mobility scheme many claimants rely heavily upon and the impact of that absence in relation to their already poor mental health, financially and the impact upon, general day to day living?
The above is a few examples but by no means comprehensive. Should the independent tribunal panel at least take these above points into consideration during appeal or am I just in a cloud, way up high with my twisted views and opinions?
Jim
-
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- BIS
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5 years 3 months ago #242759 by BIS
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by BIS on topic PIP tribunal appeal advice re MH court ruling
Hi Jim555
I will try and answer the first part of your post and then you can hope that a member might respond to the end part.
If you go here www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/help-for-claimants/pip and scroll down the page to PIP DWP resources, and look for Benchbook - this should tell you everything you wish to find out about the tribunal process and what steps the judge and the panel should take.
If you do not want to attend the tribunal and want to send someone in your place, you will have to seek permission from the judge to do so. I can't tell you whether or not the judge will agree. Sometimes they insist on the claimant being there, even if it is outside the room.
You will have to talk to the CAB whether they would be willing to attend court in your place. Just be aware this is fraught with difficulties because you will need to receive the date in plenty of time, to be able to alert them to it. I have known some people get as little as 7 days notice.
Yes, there is a greater success rate at an oral hearing but there are members here who have been successful with paper-based appeals and there are plenty of people who have no choice but to go for them. There are not any breakdowns that I am aware of the success if someone else represents the claimant.
BIS
I will try and answer the first part of your post and then you can hope that a member might respond to the end part.
If you go here www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/help-for-claimants/pip and scroll down the page to PIP DWP resources, and look for Benchbook - this should tell you everything you wish to find out about the tribunal process and what steps the judge and the panel should take.
If you do not want to attend the tribunal and want to send someone in your place, you will have to seek permission from the judge to do so. I can't tell you whether or not the judge will agree. Sometimes they insist on the claimant being there, even if it is outside the room.
You will have to talk to the CAB whether they would be willing to attend court in your place. Just be aware this is fraught with difficulties because you will need to receive the date in plenty of time, to be able to alert them to it. I have known some people get as little as 7 days notice.
Yes, there is a greater success rate at an oral hearing but there are members here who have been successful with paper-based appeals and there are plenty of people who have no choice but to go for them. There are not any breakdowns that I am aware of the success if someone else represents the claimant.
BIS
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
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5 years 3 months ago #242760 by jim555
Replied by jim555 on topic PIP tribunal appeal advice re MH court ruling
How do i go about requesting to the tribunal panel my wish for them to extend the length of my award, should I be successful? I am currently looking at the real possibility of being awarded the enhanced mobility entitlement with just under 12 months left on my award period... Therefore preventing me from a accessing the mobility car I should have been entitled to 3 years previously? Seems quite unfair...
Is it just pot luck if tribunal extend award lengths or do you need to request they consider the option? Anyone had personal experiences?
Is it just pot luck if tribunal extend award lengths or do you need to request they consider the option? Anyone had personal experiences?
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5 years 3 months ago #242770 by BIS
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by BIS on topic PIP tribunal appeal advice re MH court ruling
Hi Jim555
Be aware tribunals rarely increase the length of the award, however that doesn't mean you shouldn't try. I know of two members who have had theirs increased. You will need to make a strong case for them increasing the length arguing that a condition is not likely to improve in the short, medium or long term. You just put the request in your submission. Head it up with 'Length of the award' so it doesn't get lost or ignored in all the other stuff.
One person who got her son's award extended is Becca and it went from two years to ongoing. I don't know whether the case law she quotes will be of any use to you. Run down the thread - it is not very long
www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/forum/10-dla-e...ppealed-by-appointee
BIS
Be aware tribunals rarely increase the length of the award, however that doesn't mean you shouldn't try. I know of two members who have had theirs increased. You will need to make a strong case for them increasing the length arguing that a condition is not likely to improve in the short, medium or long term. You just put the request in your submission. Head it up with 'Length of the award' so it doesn't get lost or ignored in all the other stuff.
One person who got her son's award extended is Becca and it went from two years to ongoing. I don't know whether the case law she quotes will be of any use to you. Run down the thread - it is not very long
www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/forum/10-dla-e...ppealed-by-appointee
BIS
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5 years 3 months ago - 5 years 3 months ago #242800 by Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by Gordon on topic PIP tribunal appeal advice re MH court ruling
Jim
None of the things you mention in your post will be considered by a Tribunal panel they are only interested in the evidence and testimony submitted by you and the DWP and the applicable law.
Gordon
None of the things you mention in your post will be considered by a Tribunal panel they are only interested in the evidence and testimony submitted by you and the DWP and the applicable law.
Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Last edit: 5 years 3 months ago by Gordon.
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