Benefits and Work has obtained copies of “official sensitive” summaries of the responses to the “Modernising Support for Independent Living” Green Paper on proposed changes to Personal independence Payment (PIP).

The documents are for the attention of the Minister for Social Security and Disability and the Secretary of State, some of which are marked "Official sensitive".  

Although the consultation was started under the Conservative government, Labour allowed it to continue after they took power, receiving six thousand more responses after the date of the election.  However, they declined to publish any details of the results of the consultation and said they would not be responding to it.

At Benefits and Work we felt strongly that, after asking people to take the time and trouble to contribute, the government had a duty to share the results.

Initially, the DWP refused our request under the Freedom of Information Act to release any analysis of the consultation.

However, that decision was reversed on review, although substantial portions of some of the documents have been redacted.

Response numbers

The DWP received 16,071 responses to the consultation, made up of:

Postal: 134

Email:  1,593

Online individuals: 13,899

Online organisations: 445

Unknown organisations

The DWP summaries look at responses from organisations separately from individuals.  However, they only consider 115 organisational responses, even though hundreds more contributed.  This is because it appears that only those organisations who responded by letter or email could be identified.

As an accompanying letter to Benefits and Work from the DWP explained: 

“445 responses were recorded on the online form as coming from an organisation. However, the form did not ask for the name of the organisation. Thus it is likely that this category includes some responses from individuals.”

The result is that hundreds of organisations, including Benefits and Work, are not listed amongst the organisations who responded to the consultation because the DWP forgot to ask for organisation names in their online form.

Instead, all those organisations responses have been included in the individual respondent summaries.

Vouchers

Probably the issue that most readers will be interested in is how the suggestions that PIP should be replaced by a catalogue, vouchers, receipts or a one-off grant were received.

Amongst organisations, the DWP have recorded that 0% agreed with any of these suggestions, though a small percentage – from 16% to 9% -were neutral in regard to them. 

But overwhelmingly 92% of organisations disagreed with vouchers, 91% were against receipts, 87% were against a catalogue and 84% against a one-off grant.  Comments included:

"People should be allowed to choose how they want to spend their PIP to best help themselves.  They know what they need.  The suggested proposals  are unnecessarily  bureaucratic  & undermine a person's  ability to make decisions about  their  own  care  &  takes  away  their  control.”  Mencap

“Removing a cash payment removes the autonomy and independence of people to spend their PIP cash award freely.” - RNIB, Disability  Rights UK

The DWP assessed individual responses in a different way, looking at themes rather than percentage agreement.  Though overall, response to all the payment ideas was negative.

So for a voucher scheme, the most common theme highlighted in 45% of responses was that “it would identify individuals as benefit claimants,  potentially leading to discrimination,  exacerbated health conditions and reduced independence.”

One individual commented: “I hate the very notion of a voucher scheme for anyone,  as it stigmatises people and restricts what they spend their money on.  It's treating people like second-class citizens.  I think the government should allow people (who are already stressed and ill) to spend their benefits on how they see fit.”

Catalogues were also not popular with 31% saying there were no benefits to the idea and 29% saying that it would remove individual choice as to how they spent their money.

29% of people thought the one-off receipts system would be too complex, whilst 30% of respondents pointed out that a one-off grants system would not be suitable for ongoing or variable expenses.

As one respondent remarked:   “Most conditions that people claim PIP for are ongoing and potentially life long. A one off grant will cover some up front costs such as purchasing a wheelchair but wouldn't help with maintenance or with any of the regular day to day living expenses that are increased for those who have disabilities.”

Overwhelmingly negative

It is clear is that the vast majority of the suggestions for change made in this consultation were badly received.  For example, few people thought that placing more emphasis on what condition a claimant has, rather than its functional impact, was a good idea.

But some ideas, such as claimants not needing to be reviewed if they have a specific health condition or disability, were responded to more positively.

Often however, the DWP’s analysis of individuals’ responses is imprecise and not entirely clear. This is almost certainly because this was a hasty written and badly designed consultation which was not properly tested before being released. 

The failure to capture organisations’ names is just one example of errors that should have been picked up before the online consultation was ever published

So, when the DWP tried to analyse the results of the consultation, it has very obviously struggled to do so, not least because there were so many confusingly worded, open questions.

We’ve published all the documents we obtained so that readers can discover for themselves, as far as it is possible, what responses were given.   

What is very clear is that the DWP will have to do far better with its forthcoming green paper on welfare reform, if it is not going to find itself back in court due to the inadequacy of its consultation process.

 Downloads

Review of 1,600 individual consultation responses
This is an analysis of the responses by a sample of 1,600 people.  Although the Agree/Disagree questions cover the responses by 14,344 people.

Charities and Organisations Green Paper Response Summary 16 August
This summary provides "a detailed review of 25 influential charity and professional organisations" responses.

Charities and Organisations Green Paper Response Summary 30 August
This summary provides a detailed review of all 115 organisational responses.  Note:  many organisations including Benefits and Work are not included here because the online questionnaire asked whether you were an individual or an organisation, but then failed to ask for the name of your organisation.  So, the DWP collected what looks like responses from hundreds of unknown organisations.

Modernising Support for Independent living - Consultation Response Overview slides
This is a set of slides which review 350 individual responses, out of a total of 9,700 responses that had been received at the time the exercise was carried out.

Response topics
We're not entirely sure what this document is.  It contains lists of general and granular topics

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  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 4 days ago
    How could anyone be beutral to this >>>>>

    Amongst organisations, the DWP have recorded that 0% agreed with any of these suggestions, though a small percentage – from 16% to 9% -were neutral in regard to them. 
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    · 5 days ago
    If a voucher scheme is implemented, what will happen to schemes like Motability? And fuel for Motability vehicles? 
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    · 6 days ago
    We have to have a say on the coming consultation and we have to say a big NO for any suggestions that may:
    * increase the threshold of PIP.
    * make pip mean tested.
    * introduce one-off payment.
    * more regular assessments.
    * strict to eligibility for pip.

    We are lucky to have the previous consultation that has been ignored to have a thoughtful thinking about how the deep state thinks about PIP.

    Please please engage with the coming consultation.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 4 days ago
      @Alex It's based on need, not wealth.  And I think you'll find that wealthy people don't even bother to claim it!  Because why would they go through all those assessments etc, if they don't need the money?  :-)  Where would the bar be set for means testing?  It could exclude those who really need the extra help but have a reasonable income.  So no - means-testing isn't appropriate.  The wealthy will not be claiming PIP.  They can still get a blue badge without claiming PIP - if needed.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 4 days ago
      @Alex How can you means test disability? 
      The disability benefit goes towards the additional things you need when you’re disabled! The poorer people can use PIP to access further benefits that are means tested!
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 4 days ago
      @Alex It is also meant to support disabled people who work. It is not an out of work benefit. So therefore can’t be means-tested.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 4 days ago
      @Alex You do not have to be rich to fall into means-testing. I was on means-tested benefits for 30 years, after loss of career. Now due to an inheritance, I have to use my state pension to cover my rent, and my PIP to cover everything else.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 5 days ago
      @Alex Alex. I was just going to vote your comment down but felt I must explain. means testing is so incredibly expensive administratively that it wastes huge amounts of money better spent on a non-means-tested payment.. The rich people that would lose it are too few I believe to "save" enough to cover the cost. If you're unsure about the costs of doing means testing, please check out the proposals for Universal Basic Income. The people pushing it have done their sums very carefully, I know one of them and they can be trusted.https://citizensincome.org/
      And the other huge. huge argument against means-testing PIP is that your idea would force every single sick and disabled person, including those with depression, anxiety, autism, to be able to provide all the financial proof information and complete those forms on top of the existing PIP ones. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 6 days ago

    As for the vouchers: PIP assesmant, MR/Tribunal, costly voucher aprooval = like the good old: "hung, drawn and quartered"  of the dissabled
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 6 days ago
    I contributed to this and I'll be extremely angry if our views are now going to be ignored. 
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    · 6 days ago
    Surely a disabled person who can barely work is taking a job away from a abled bodied person .
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 6 days ago
    Tell your local New Labour mp .. politically you are finished .. if you are as disabled as I.. get straight on to your local  mp yours ..  s 
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    · 6 days ago
    Thank you b&w for putting post up. I really do think if you have a diagnosed life long disability condition and need help with most activities ie washing and dressing etc etc there are many  human act laws to protect the disabled people. This government differently needs real disabled people who have to live with these terrible conditions and hear their inputs to get us in their side than maybe government can show passion to us all 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    This is great news. Does this mean then the DWP have to leave us alone?
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    · 7 days ago
    Thank you to the B&W team for uncovering this information.

    I suspect many claimants took time to consider and phrase their responses carefully despite the poorly worded questions. It is disappointing to learn that I have wasted an afternoon responding to a consultation that in hindsight, was not fit for purpose. Thus we will need to go through the whole procedure again, even though we are unwell and often exhausted.  Fight on we will though as experience suggests they are hoping we will give up and go away.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Bert Bert .. the Americans are 379 trillion in debt ... do they look worried .. all they do is make bullets and bombs ..  oh and print money .. Don't capitulate Bert.. no politician has the political right to put you in an early grave .
      Yours ..s 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @tom The government have no money owe 2.8 trillion
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Prudent It’s still worth filling out as hopefully the dwp got the point that 1600+ cares enough to spend time to fill in a very lengthy form

      If less than 100 responded the dwp would of used that as an excuse to do whatever the hell they like (we got some concessions in the wca consultation but not many as not many filled it out)

      If the dwp didn’t read the responses properly and that’s on them (and if that’s obvious from the official dwp response then that could be used as evidence in a future lawsuit that the dwp continue to cut corners and not do things in the honest and correct manner)

      I think if anything for the upcoming wca consultation rerun the disabled community should aim for 10k+ individual responses 

      Yes details of responses are important - but facts and figures such as number of responses are just as, if not more important as it conveys the message that ppl are interested and changes can’t be silently pushed through, that the disabled community won’t stay silent in all this
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Prudent Hopefully It will be shelved , Because it is insanity ,
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    · 7 days ago
    It appears that about 95% of the thousands of responses were negative and the other 5% were from Fraser Nelson.

    Is there a bigger waste of time than constantly assessing people with lifelong conditions that have already "passed" multiple assessments already?  It is basically performative cruelty to titillate the press. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Louise I agree with you. These  assessments are there to trip people up. I have just had a telephone assessment which was 3 hours long. The dwp kept asking the same questions a different way around. I have kept my award but the stress it has caused me has increased my anxiety. I have several physical conditions and anxiety and depression caused by stress of everything else that happened to me. I now hope so more assessments due to my age.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 5 days ago
      @sausage belly I'm just being realistic
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      · 5 days ago
      @Dave Dee
      It's ideological with Nelson. He's a dyed in the wool neoliberal Thatcherite: rich = good, poor = bad; private sector = good, state sector = bad. It's really as simple as that with him, with the exception he's far less bothered about massive amounts of public money regularly going to subsidize the rich. IMO he also believes in the "Just World" fallacy: the rich "deserve" to be rich because they're hard working and smart, the poor "deserve" to be poor because they're lazy and dull.

      Specifically with benefits, I suspect he thinks the more that gives big business and capital as much power to exploit the "lower" classes the better. His concern about welfare fraud is frankly performative IMO - he must know that it's been consistently shown to be trivial in overall terms and dwarfed by tax evasion or avoidance. What he really wants is for substantial benefit cuts to the poor to fund tax cuts to the rich.

      Also, similarly to unions, sickness and unemployment benefits can act as a safety net or "bargaining power" against exploitative working conditions. They give you a much needed "breathing space" to deal with the stress caused by toxic work environments and management before you look for a better job, or can give you the security you need to challenge those toxic conditions without fear of immediate poverty if they sack you. Cutting them strengthens the hand of the bosses against that of the workers and unions.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Louise 5% negative fraser Nelson and Bert posting here on B&W it seems!
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Louise No, it is great money making business idea.   Sadly, they will never run out of work...  No politytian or their families should be allowed to have shares in such enterprise like ATHOS.   Thos assesment centers, should be NON profit!
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago

    It's bewildering there are actually lawmakers out there who still think "disabled people = Buy everyone a wheelchair and yup, that's it, good to go..." when in the real world, the most severely disabled people usually need ongoing help from other people a lot more than they need to buy one off 'things' from catalogues.

  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    I have epilepsy&multiple learning difficulties&special needs. I can’t work yet Am super stressed&anxious that the Labour Party may force me into a job I can’t do . I still have black outs a few times a week due to my epilepsy and headaches that last a few days .Am very worried&nervous and reeves isn’t gonna say more until end of March which is a long time away 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @tom Tom I am having posts denied on here . And yes tom to that post
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      · 6 days ago
      @Tomf DUTY OF CARE, SUE hem!!!!
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    All the pretense that they are trying to help the disabled. 
    Both Conservatives and Labour alike, have no interest in how we struggle to live our lives. 
    It's a money saving exercise, plain and simple!!
    It's disgusting and shameful, I'm absolutely sick of it all.

  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    What a surprise, nobody liked it.  No wonder they didn't want to release the results. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Alex PJ , yes son , yes son Yes son ! You nailed it boy !!!!!!!!! You saw through starmers tribes LIES .
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    What is evident here is typical dwp behaviour and how they deal with benefit claims - nothing investigated thoroughly; no coherent conclusions; snatching at details that suit them and creating their own narrative because they have not even asked sufficient or the right sorts of questions to reveal the truth. If it was strategy rather than incompetence you'd have to admire it, were it not so damaging.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    Thank you, Benefits and Work team. :)
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 7 days ago
    Again it is very obvious that the majority of responses in the sample agree that a formal diagnosis must be required to qualify for PIP and that is what they are spelling out in the news nowadays.

    Some may argue that it is already required in the current system but I remind them that self reported problems on your medical report is not a formal diagnosis and to get pip nowadays you do not need to have a diagnosis.

    Self reporting symptoms of an illness is not a diagnosis of that illness as the diagnosis, in most cases, requires an input from a specialist specially for mental illness.

    What I mean by self reporting is that when you go to the GP and tell him I have this and that and he types what you say in your medical report and prescribe you a medication giving you some advice about your symptoms without going into details and when you take the medication and read about it you find it treats this and that then you will come to your mind that you have this and that.

    I know this comment will disappoint some/majority of you but we have to face the reality and prepare for what is coming to us.

    Best of luck for us.








    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 4 days ago
      @CC Transfer care to local authorities or the NHS was also a bad idea!
      Both of their budgets are stretched and it would become a postcode lottery!
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 5 days ago
      @sevenbees A formal diagnosis by a consultant and not just a gp should be compulsory to qualify for disability benefits.

    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 5 days ago
      @Sevenbees I’m sorry but you’re completely incorrect. The downs are other fellow commenters disagreeing with your comment. That’s correct there is no pip without a formal diagnosis, you can’t just call pip and say.  I have xyz sure here’s your pip. The whole infrastructure of pip is you have to have a diagnosed illness, gps also psychologists, don’t just give out medication without a formal diagnosis. And allow any patient to just Google there medication and automatically self diagnose there selves. Absolutely you are fully correct in believing your own statement. But you are completely incorrect. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @CC
      Some of my health problems diagnosis time:
      right away, 5 years, 7 years, and the most debilitating one over 12 years.    Unless they have a proof and can put a fancy medical term to it, no chance of formal medical diagnosis.    My daily problems with consciousness were dismissed.   Now, the doctors are calling it Syncope, and there is even a specialist clinic for it!   Telling countless doctors, "I'm passing out, every day", no doctor would understand or tuch the issue... They all run scare, and make up, as it is all in patents immagination.  
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 6 days ago
      @Sevenbees I don't understand your comment.   12 downs on your comments disagree with you not agree with you?  Your comment made it sound as if 12 down on your comment were agreeing with you and justifying it?  Most people who have ever applied for PIP know you need a massive amount of evidence, never self disagnosis
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