Most commentators have assumed that the Conservatives would always vote in favour of anything that resembled a benefits cut. But there now seems to be a possibility that the Tories are planning to support Labour rebels and vote against Labour’s Green Paper.

On 18 May, Conservative MP Helen Whately told the Standard: “Labour’s plans dodge the difficult decisions on welfare, leave more people out of work than they put in and will hit some of the nation’s poorest people.

“The sickness benefits bill is spiralling out of control and these rushed reforms will make things worse, not better.

“These plans are cruel, careless and clumsy. And it seems that even some of the people closest to Reeves agree with us, not her.”

What makes this total condemnation of the Green Paper particularly noteworthy is that Whately is the Conservative shadow secretary for work and pensions.  It seems unlikely that she would have been so outspoken in her criticism without party approval.

It is clear that the rebellion on Labour’s back benches has been growing in the two months since the Green Paper was published.

On 1 April, the Labour List website published the names of 27 MPs who said they would rebel against the government and 15 more who had expressed opposition to the Green Paper.

On 8 May, 42 Labour MPs wrote to the prime minister to say the cuts were impossible to support.

On 15 May, ITV reported that 50 Labour MPs were set to rebel, including the 42 who had signed the original letter.  100 MPs had also signed a private letter to Starmer urging the government to delay the changes and rethink its proposals. At least 6 MPs signed both letters.

Which suggests that somewhere in the region of 130 Labour MPs oppose the cuts, though there is no suggestion they would all vote against them.

The labour leadership are said to be considering a number of ways to buy off the rebels.  These include changes to the winter fuel payment means-test, changes to the two child limit or changes to the benefits cap. 

The idea will be to tell rebel MPs that the government doesn’t have the cash help these groups and also to drop its Green Paper cuts.

Whether this is a pitch that will work, remains to be seen.

But there seems to be at least a possibility that the Conservatives are now positioning themselves to take advantage of Labour’s disarray.

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  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 15 days ago
    The hypocrisy of both the Conservatives and Labour regarding welfare reform austerity, benefit cuts etc is nauseating. The 14 years of deaths related to Ian Duncan Smith, Stephen Crabb, Amber Rudd, Therese Coffey, Esther McVey and all the other awful Tory Work and Pensions secretaries! Now the Tories are planning to vote against this is laughable when they caused so much unnecessary misery. With Labour now back in government with a huge majority these MPs, ministers and the secretary of state for Work and Pensions Liz Kendall.
    When Labour were all in opposition they all constantly voted against welfare cuts and always voted for an increase in benefits for people who are unfit and unwell enough to work. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 17 days ago
    All I will say is that I attended the Leeds DWP Pathways to Work Event on Wednesday 21st May. The introductory welcome speech announced that they are hoping to implement the 4 point rule changes for PIP in April 2026 and if that isn't possible, then at the very latest November 2026. So...goes to show you, they've kept that quiet. 
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    · 18 days ago
    Dont put nothing past this evil government they trying to do things on the sly thinking it won't get leaked well it has someone wouldn't just say it does  sounds true that it's going to happen it has to be stopped people can report this and  email MPs and phone other departments to report the leaked info so they know they can't be sly about things that people do find out the truth .
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 18 days ago
    Just seen this posted on Scope forum...  I have no idea how true any of the claims made are though and I don't know how credible the youtube channel is...


    "Hi everyone,

    I just watched Dynamic Duo on YouTube. Rich has received an email from someone claiming to be dwp . He receives them regularly and knows of people within dwp . He cannot confirm if this is true so I definitely can’t but according to this email the dwp staff have been told to implement the 4 Point rule from this June . But he also said he thinks there will be another u turn . He said there’s 8 month back log as it is so this can only make it worse. Now I can’t validate this but should this be sent to someone who’s on our side for them to look into it ? What do you all think , could this be true ? It seems weird to me as if we had an assessment and failed due to no 4 point now before it’s in law we could appeal and probably sue"

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      · 18 days ago
      @Mick This just sounds like clickbait. There’s no way they can do this without legislation being implemented first. 
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      · 18 days ago
      @Mick Timms has multiple times in the last month stated 4pt rule comes into play November (no clue if that applied to claimants midway through pip review? - eg filled and sent back pip review paperwork but not had f2f/phone assessment let?)

      If your source is correct this is a huge lie and betrayal on labours part and disabled ‘trust’ in dwp and labour leadership will be all but gone………..probably permanently for the next decade at least
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Starmer and Reeves the worst pair ever? Come on Labour: table a vote of no confidence and get real leaders in.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    What to do if you do not score 4 points in any one daily living PIP descriptor, and are beside yourself with worry, but you have an extremely serious disease, and will keep collapsing, if forced into a workplace, and you meet the LCWRA under mobility and risk, and the Govs 208 severe conditions criteria and will never work again, but rely on benefits for your income?

    Perhaps it would be more humane if the (sick ignorant twisted) Government offered to send someone out to euthanise you?!

    Are we supposed to stat writing out how our symptoms affect us and then start sending them into our completely disinterested MPs'?!? 

    So that they have a Ohhhhh! Moment?! 

    Do we really have to go that far?! 

    The MPs you see talking about these cuts on TV do not have a clue, that much is very very obvious. Its scary watching their babble. 

    How belittling. Where the hell are the medics in all of this? Why arent the bloody doctors up in arms, threatening to strike if their seriously ill patients are going to have the majority of their income taken away, leaving them in dire straits?!? 


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      · 18 days ago
      @MATT Im sorry, Im very jaded and have been through hell because i got a rare disease, but in my professional existence I dealt at CEO and MD level, across a variety of professions, and imo, if youve been to a good boarding school, and got a first from a quadrangle university, you wouldnt go into medicine and work for the nhs if you only wanted to make money...!
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      · 18 days ago
      @Dan I think the medics will complain when they get thousands of patients queuing up trying to get additional medical evidence to send to the DWP.  The only thing doctors are interested in is their pay and pensions. Whoever said those entering medical school (predominantly from private education) are doing it because they want to help people were very naive....
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    I was written to by the Work and Pensions Committee today, stating that my evidence about the consultation etc is being published shortly.  On that website is what we can, perhaps, best call an interim report on their inquiry into the green paper.   It can be found here:

    https://committees.parliament.uk/publications/48071/documents/251308/default/

    Here is the closing paragraphs of the letter they have sent to Liz Kendall:

    "We ask the Government to delay any changes to PIP eligibility or UC rates, extend and
    expand the current consultation, and work to co-produce measures with disabled people and
    their organisations, reflecting the Government’s commitment on ‘nothing about me, without
    me’. We strongly recommend that the Government take a ‘precautionary principle’ approach
    and immediately undertake an independent, comprehensive analysis of the impact of the
    proposed cuts in UC health support on employment, poverty and health outcomes.

    We also urge the Government to delay its plans to amend the eligibility criteria for the daily
    living component of PIP and engage disabled people and their organisations in order to coproduce proposals for a new PIP, as part of the PIP review. Most importantly, we need to
    guarantee that those who need PIP will not lose out. At that point, it should publish and
    properly consult on its proposals more widely.

    I would be grateful for your response to these conclusions and recommendations by Monday 2
    June 2025. As is usual practice with the Committee’s correspondence, I will be publishing this
    letter and your response on the Committee’s website. "

    I believe that this is a HUGE win for us, even if Kendall refuses to delay the decisions and to "extend and expand the current consultation."   It means the committee have found in our favour, and I'm sure we can use that against the DWP going forward in whatever campaigns take place.  
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      · 18 days ago
      @Anon They're not going to reassess before people are due.  They can't do that because it would block up the system entirely. And a new pip was always in the plans.  But delaying the pip changes means lots more people will see their next reassessment under the old rules rather than the new. 
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      · 18 days ago
      @Anon
      Have to agree, I'm sick to the back teeth of the constant stress, fear and uncertainty, goalposts being moved, assessments carried out by these profit making fraudulent companies that have been banned from operating in other countries, being always made to feel like we are liars and fraudsters, now they want to breach our rights to privacy by having permanent surveillance of our bank accounts.  Not to mention all the rest of it.

      Like you, I just want to be left alone to live the best I can and in peace, without having to always worry what's coming next from the DWP and Houses Of Parliament.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @SLB Fantastic work SLB!
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @SLB Actually the bit about a new pip is very worrying, it gives them a chance to reassess everyone no matter their award length,I'm not on board with that,every time we get a pip renewal we go through he'll with stress as it is,why can't they just leave us alone
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @SLB Excellent SLB!

      May I suggest that you repost on today's new news thread?
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Well now.....


    The headline to the above: "Labour could review other benefit cuts after winter fuel U-turn, sources say"

    No details about what revisiting disabilty cuts might entail, and it's supposedly dependent on the economy improving (which is definitely totally convincing). But after Kendall's dismal speech this morning, this is the first indication of a chink in the armour. It does suggest that they are starting to get rattled about the scale of opposition on the Labour benches - why offer so much as a hint of any backtracking otherwise? I would guess that the Work and Pensions Committee calling for the cuts to be paused has not exactly helped their cause either. The pressure on Labour MPs seems to be having an effect and needs to be maintained.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @sara
      I certainly see nothing wrong with asking a sympathetic MP to try to persuade their colleagues to vote the right way.

      I think we're already past the point at which threats from the whips carry much force. It's different if only a handful of MPs speak out - the whips can easily pick them off. But when 42 MPs have called the cuts impossible to support, and 100 have written to Starmer urging a change of course, that is far too many for the whips to handle. What  can they do - threaten to withdraw the whip from all of them? Clearly not.

      That's why the momentum needs to be maintained: the more MPs are willing to rebel the less power the whips have and the more the government will have to listen, whether it wants to or not. It's clear that they will have to be dragged kicking and screaming to change their policy on sickness and disability cuts. Since any backtracking will have to be forced on them it''s essential to keep up the pressure on Labour MPs.  
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @tintack Yes, and I wonder whether we should up the anti by inviting even the sympathetic and rebel mps to pressure their unsympathetic colleagues into supporting us and voting against the green paper. With enough momentum things could turn from mps being afraid to defy the whip to their being afraid of voting on the losing side - if the vote goes against the cuts.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Wow, first hint Labour could be rattled on welfare cuts??


    Downing Street said the change was a result of an improved economic landscape, with sources saying ministers could revisit policies including the two-child benefit cap or health and disability cuts if the economy continued to improve.


    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @Gingin
      "Wow, first hint Labour could be rattled on welfare cuts??"

      Probably an attempt to bribe their own MPs to throw sick and disabled people under the bus. I'm not sure that will fly though, especially not now that the Work and Pensions select committee has called for the cuts to be paused due to, among other things, concern over increased risk of suicides. Any Labour MP who supports the cuts after a concern like that has been voiced is taking a position which Sir Humphrey would no doubt describe as "courageous".
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    ITV News did a big segment tonight (Weds 21st) about the gathering disquiet over welfare reform and Debbie Abrams (sp??) of the Work and Pensions Committee is now calling for a pause to cuts. ITV think concessions will have to be made 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @Anon That’s kind but it’s down to many warriors on here and each and every person that does whatever they can 
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      · 19 days ago
      @Gingin Any good outcome will be due in large part to your huge efforts for the cause, gingin. We salute you.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Just had my email reply from Sarah olney mp from lib dems and it’s very encouraging she states if the government was serious about cutting welfare spending labour would get serious about fixing the health and social care also tye broken dwp office also kicking into gear the new hospitals needed instead of kicking into the long grass. Also liberal democrats have still not seen the legislation and also the official impact assessment at the moment. We will not be voting for the reform has it is planned until we see more clarification on the reform green paper. So that was my email I have received and it’s encouraging that we will fight this reform with liberals and hopefully conservatives on our side thank you for reading 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 18 days ago
      @Old Mother I think this was all money driven. Once they said there was a 20bn blackhole Rach's self-imposed fiscal rules meant she had to fill it. We are sitting ducks
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @diceman24 It is too rushed. As if welfare reform is just a tick box to Labour to « show » their achievements.  I agree with Sarah that if they were serious they would be investing in people’s health, not just empty promises. Lib dems seem to be the decent ones right now. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Apparently Committee of MPs urge Starmer to pause disability cuts amid poverty fears in letter seen by ITV News is latest headline tonight and heard somewhere else the uturn on winter fuel won't be enough to stop rebellion.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @Dez Well said . It won’t even save them that much because making people destitute means they’ll become another government problem at social services. I really don’t believe these proposals can work. Pushing and bullying won’t make disability go away. 
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      · 19 days ago
      @Lill "the uturn on winter fuel won't be enough to stop rebellion." Of course it wont. It's downright insulting. 
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      · 19 days ago
      @Lill It's truly sickening how Starmer is even refusing to consider a delay or a pause on voting these proposals through until a full impact statement can be done. He just wants to write things into law as quickly as possible before the consequences can be fully realised so he doesn't lose his precious votes and it'll be too late to do anything.

      He's playing with the lives of millions of people and he knows it. It's downright baffling how seemingly nobody can step up and say this is deplorable and plugging your ears in the evidence of people dying needlessly to save a few quid shouldn't be how anybody - let alone a person in a position of power - should operate.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Notice Starmer was very careful to say it's will be a fiscal event, likely meaning in the Autumn statement.  If it is affordable...

    So, not definite then?

    We'll use it now to quell any rebellion against cuts to the disabled and get that voted through.  Then come the Autumn statement, sorry it's unaffordable to change the winter fuel allowance because Rachel from accounts made another cock-up and things didn't quite go to plan... but it's good that we got the benefit cuts through and devastated the lives of 1.4 million disabled, ill and the most vulnerable in our country.  We did get 3 disabled people into unpaid voluntary jobs for a couple of weeks...  Job well done, even if we do say so ourselves!
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    CAB have now turned on the government, and more unions.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @Leprechaun. I wondered why the unions have ignored their disabled and retired members. Useless money grabbers like their Labour overlords. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    People need to keep emailing MPs before vote and say the cuts can't happen not all MPs will buy the uturn and abig number should still vote against the cuts .
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @Lill Yes and we are watching those who abstain.  Or absent themselves from voting.  Vote for those who clearly don’t support this performative cruelty.  
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    Lies, hypocrisy and cruelty. You’re finished Starmer. 

    I never thought I’d say that but there we are.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @The Dogmother "PCS’s Department of Work and Pensions group president Angela Grant meanwhile said that violence at jobcentres has “escalated off the planet” due to a rise in far-right rhetoric by politicians.

      She said that a member of staff had their car set on fire, others have been issued death threats and blades have been carried into jobcentres."

      Yep, I'd consider this Exhibit A-Z as to why very few are willing to work at a Jobcentre.

      To be honest, whoever is working at Jobcentres should absolutely stand up alongside disabled people. The government doesn't care about us finding work, so they certainly don't care about your safety. You're also a sacrifice they're willing to make.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 19 days ago
    The whole process gives insufficient chance for in depth debate. The fact the speaker of the hoc will stop anyone for not being brief says it all about an administration that will not settle to a task and work it through thoroughly.

    So few of those responsible for devising, deciding on or implementing these welfare measures have even the slimmest understanding of the system. They just want to sweep forward, further and faster, brushing all the untidy loose ends under the carpet, leaving the whole muddle to surface and smother us when it's too late to sort it.

    There's no regard for those who are bound to be collateral damage, it's just an experiment.
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      · 19 days ago
      @Gingin Sure thing, Gingin! Especially when they either don't have the intellect to work it all out and/or can't be bothered to put in the hours, we have to tell them how it is and what to do.

      I've found it quite a successful strategy with MRs and tribunals. One judge fired back at me, when I laid out a point and said "but, you know that" and she said "well you've told us that". I still won, though, and I really don' t think we will fail.
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      · 19 days ago
      @godgivemestrength Yes, you’re right. But if we have to spoon feed them the information, let’s keep it coming. Let’s make sure they can’t ignore us. Keep biting at their heels until we become too annoying to ignore. I’m a realist, and I know we might fail, but if we lie down and give up we most definitely will. 
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    · 19 days ago
    I'll write again to Race (Exeter MP) again, but not hopeful he has changed his mind. 

    We need at least 75 labour MP's to vote against the planned changes in the Green Paper (not just to abstain).  If we do get a really substantial rebellion then Starmer/Reeves/Kendall may decide to change tack/concessions. We can hope that the House of Lords, and particularly when the Bill enters the committee stage, that amendments will be made.  It will not be perfect and clearly the days of the welfare state as a whole are numbered, but at least it may not be totally catastrophic. Keep mentioning: a, the added costs that these cuts will provoke (mandatory reconsiderations, tribunals and added stress on social care and the medical professions) and b: that as a block we are very large minority who can - and hopefully will - vote against labour at the next GE, although I fear what the consequences of that might be....
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @MATT I wrote to my MP again for a second time to see if she might change her mind . Still awaiting an answer but I do know that her original reply was the almost exact words of some other MP reply that was put on this site .. Are they all told to write the same answer in their replies. 
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